Forum Topic

EV Lamp-post charging

Hounslow have plans to roll out a large number of on-street charging points utilising existing lamp-posts. You can find lists of proposed locations here.https://bit.ly/evhounslow

Bruce Hammal ● 39d91 Comments

Shell’s now charging £0.58/kwh - much more than a Tesla Supercharger

Taylor Wescoatt ● 4d

I'm thinking the budget for EV chargers probably  too small for what people want, And as the lamp posts are already there and spaced apart so won't take up all the parking, is being viewed as a cheaper option.

Janice Evans ● 18d

Turnover of parking is always an issue, Paul. Sorry to disappoint.30-minute free shopping ring a bell?Still, no comment from you on charging Ubers and delivery vans on idling. So as long as you beseech people to discuss other ways of moving commerce, take the lead. Let's hear what you have to say on the matter.

David Lesniak ● 18d

Too many cars, too much driving, not enough people willing to discuss better ways of moving people and goods around.

Paul James ● 18d

Do you think that once you have actually made that jump from ICE to EV you are always going to want even better/faster charging?I often wonder where visiting trades people manage to park nowadays when so many streets are lined with parked cars. 

Philippa Bond ● 18d

Jackie, thanks for that.It sounds as if you are saying what Hounslow have proposed is what you are going to end up with, and hence the consultation is a sham.If so, that’s rubbish, and I hope that Hounslow get their comeuppance in the upcoming elections.

Andrew Jones ● 19d

Andrew, the problem is Hounslow simply haven’t listened to drivers and residents or observed their actual  preferences. They are just ploughing on regardless. My neighbourhood is also near shops. Very few of the EV drivers use or want more or any  lamp post charging. But we are getting it anyway.

Jackie Elton ● 19d

David, it would help ( I think) to distinguish between residential locations and locations closer to businesses.Where I live, the number of people parking to access businesses is minimal. If they are parking for that purpose they will park closer to the premises they want to access.People charging their cars who use them daily would probably do so overnight, while those who use their cars irregularly might do it overnight, or they might do it during the day.On the high street, or streets nearby where people actually only stay an hour or two or three, then agreed, a lamp post charging facility doesn't bring much to the party, and ability to fast charge would be something that might address the loss of electric car driver business due to the much easier ability to charge in car parks and malls.So in residential areas where there isn't much short term parking from people accessing businesses etc. there is a place for an easy to implement, slower solution. IMHO anyway.

Andrew Jones ● 19d

>This would also be bad for business because people wouldn't have the ability to top up enough while having lunch or buying something along the high streets.What percentage of people do you think get around london by car?100%?70%30%5%?

Paul James ● 19d

If lamppost chargers were ubiquitous, there'd be no need to dedicate bays. Simply find the next available. But if you install crappy, slow chargers, people will likely charge overnight only.This would also be bad for business because people wouldn't have the ability to top up enough while having lunch or buying something along the high streets. Meanwhile, they can drive to a mall, plug in, charge up effectively, and be on their way. It would also mean spaces would sit there used only for slow charging so no turn over  - again, bad for business. Perpetuating an already bad system isn't the solution.

David Lesniak ● 19d

I think you got the essence of my long post David.With fast chargers in residential streets you would need to reduce the parking spaces available to those who aren’t charging either during the CPZ hours of operation or possibly 24 hours a day.With lamppost chargers there isn’t the same compelling need to restrict parking.If I had a fully electric car my personal preference would likely be for having some faster chargers available in the street if they aren’t too visually obtrusive. Having said that I live somewhere where there is relatively low parking “stress” Both have pros and cons. You’d never bother to put a 7kW charger at a service station.

Andrew Jones ● 19d

Jackie is right that there do seem to be a lot of bad reviews for Shell/Ubitricity EV charging. It also seems that at one point UK Power Networks stopped the work on putting lamppost ones in but it has now been given the go ahead again.  I did also wonder about Shell's commitment with their changes and new CEO as it also looked as though they were more interested in putting in new EV stations like the one in Fulham.

Philippa Bond ● 19d

Except, Michael, if I'm understanding Andrew's point about LBHF policies, bays do not have to be dedicated. But you've never been one to see things with a wider lens. You've always advocated for the barest, least minimum amount of average.

David Lesniak ● 19d

Blatent AI interpretation of the electric car charging problem:Imagine a shared household where everyone insists on owning and using their own kettle in the kitchen. Each kettle needs a socket, wiring, and space on the counter. Soon the kitchen becomes a tangle of cords and plugs - not because kettles are bad, but because the assumption that everyone must have one inefficient. The sensible solution isn’t to install more sockets; it’s to rethink how we boil water. Maybe we share a communal kettle, or stagger usage, or design a system where fewer kettles serve more people.That’s the same logic with electric cars. The issue isn’t the number of chargers but the expectation that every driver will have a personal charging bay outside their home. Urban space, power supply, and equity can’t stretch to that model. The real progress comes from reducing car dependency — more walking, cycling, and shared transport — so the “kettle problem” doesn’t arise at all.

Paul James ● 20d

Of course you are whining and you have nothing to propose other than the vague and meaningless statement "build solutions".You will lose parking spaces if there are fast chargers on a street because either the charger itself will be built on the roadway to avoid taking away pavement space and there will be dedicated bays beside the charger.  The additional cost of fast chargers makes no sense if they can't be used because an ICE vehicle is parked beside them. Concern about "depriving drivers of much needed parking space" seems strange from a person who campaigned for more parking controls on Sundays.

Michael Robinson ● 20d

Zapmap clearly shows the prices as 76p per kw while the Shell App says 54p. I am most EV drivers voted with our feet long ago and found solutions in car parks and dedicated EV charging stations. But if Mr Robinson thinks I’m whining, why not read some Trust pilot reviews for some of these lamp post chargers. They complain about rip offs, technical failures, having money witheld and not returned, horrible customer service.  Shell Recharge gets 1.star, you can’t get lower, while bp pulse which operates on the A4 has glowing reviews.  The reviewers aren’t whining, they are writing about their “lived experience”.  Most Lamp post chargers are not reliable, not popular and not value for money. And they deprive other drivers of much needed parking space. And now in Hounslow, it’s almost a monopoly.

Jackie Elton ● 20d

I saw at a garage 65p for electric charging. Three weeks later it was 75p. Seemed a big increase in a short time.

Nicholas Beard ● 20d

By the way, I do agree with Jackie’s point about putting the prices charged under a bit more scrutiny. If, as suggested the prices of lamp post chargers have increased so there is no or little differential compared to fast chargers, then that suggests a bit of excessive profiteering.

Andrew Jones ● 20d

I’m not going to dispute what the prices showing on ZapMap are shown to be, however I’ve just downloaded the Shell Ubitricity App and it is indicating that the price per kWH is 54 pence, plus a 35 pence connection fee for all the 5kW and 7kW chargers in my area. Most of them (and possibly all) are lamppost chargers. There aren’t any (Shell Ubitricity) fast chargers nearby, the closest ones are near the Duke of Sussex at the MFG petrol station are 81 pence per kWH.Now it could be that my app is showing me the wrong price, but I’d be a little surprised if that was the case. I’ll charge my hybrid sometime and see what the true price turns out to be and if it’s really 76pence per kWH then I’ll report that back.The advantages of lamp post chargers (as I see them) are that they can be cheaper, you are likely to be able to not have to drive too far from near where you live to access one, and they are easier to install without having upgrade the existing power grid.The disadvantages are speed, reliability and sometimes availability.I don’t know about Hounslow and what has been proposed as regards parking near any proposed new chargers, lamp post or otherwise.In LBHF, the lamppost chargers that I tend to use don’t have any additional parking restrictions near them compared to the rest of the same road.That means that you might find that you can’t use a particular lamp post chargers either because you can’t park close enough because of other vehicles or because although you can park close enough there is a vehicle that has already connected up. There is no requirement to move a car once charging has been completed. There are some bays in LBHF dedicated to electric cars where you aren’t meant to park if you’re not actively charging.The comment I would make about installing fast chargers on residential roads is that it will cost more, not only for the charger but more than likely to provide the power that goes to the fast charger. This being the case, to recoup the investment you will need to charge more - that’s fine, you are paying a higher price for a premium service, but you will also need to make that charger accessible to anyone who wants to charge their car, when it’s not already actively charging a car.That means loss of parking space in residential roads where fast chargers are installed. Maybe not 24 hours a day, but certainly when the CPZ is active.If residents are happy with that, fine, but it is an issue that needs to be acknowledged. The question is, who do you ask about what they want to happen? All the residents in the road? Or all the CPZ permit holders in the road? Or all the residents in the whole CPZ?

Andrew Jones ● 20d

The coolant on my bike is free!

Paul James ● 20d

"I was thinking about business deliveries to shops etc... not home deliveries"As ever, Paul, you fail miserably at seeing the whole picture.Interesting you didn't comment on NYC wanting to charge delivery vehicles and Ubers a fee to idle on the streets.

David Lesniak ● 20d

So your answer is, "build solutions" - you are still being totally vague.It really does appear that you are scared to come out and say that you want fast chargers on your street and are happy this will reduce parking spaces, or happy this will reduce pavement space for pedestrians.

Michael Robinson ● 20d

>I mean, you literally proposed something to facilitate deliveries.I was thinking about business deliveries to shops etc... not home deliveries.

Paul James ● 21d

Build your dream are introducing 1500kw fast chargers that will charge to 80% in five minutes. I was surprised to see it can cost £500.00 to change the coolant in an electric car.

Nicholas Beard ● 21d

So glad you asked what we do want. It isn’t what I want, it needs to be sound research on all EV driver’s experience. First of all find out from existing Ev drivers how they charge their cars and what they want more of and less of. Find out what they think of lamp post chargers, and check how many are being used, when and for how long.  Ascertain why the prices have shot up to 76p per kw on the lamp post chargers and why it’s drifting into a monopoly with no price controls. Then publish that research and build solutions rather than imposing more and more of the infrastructure on our streets that we (not just me) say we rarely use and don’t want more of. And which causes frustration and resentment from drivers who can’t park. (We already told the Council this, and they have ignored us.)Then we might start to build more sensible and workable solutions. The market is getting there anyway.

Jackie Elton ● 21d

I mean, you literally proposed something to facilitate deliveries.

David Lesniak ● 21d

https://www.zapmap.com/ev-stats/charging-price-index

Philippa Bond ● 21d

>you don’t want fast chargers on the pavement of residential streets I used a fast charger at an A3 service station once. It made  a lot of noise, but it kept my freezing hands warm with teh hot air coming out the back!

Paul James ● 21d

All you do is whine about what you don’t want but you refuse to say what you do want.Is it correct to assume that you don’t want fast chargers on the roadway of residential streets because that would reduce parking spaces, you don’t want fast chargers on the pavement of residential streets because that would reduce space for pedestrians so you are perfectly happy driving to drive to places like the BP station on the A4 and enjoy the view while you charge your car there.

Michael Robinson ● 21d

>Per his plan, there would be no need for any high street shops because everything would be delivered.I mean I'm literally saying support local shops by going to local high streets instead of driving to out of town supermarkets.

Paul James ● 21d

Poor Paul doesn't understand a thing about urbanism. No surprise.Per his plan, there would be no need for any high street shops because everything would be delivered. On that note, a recent NY Times article on the impact of the congestion zone in Manhattan one year on, items mentioned for tweaking are charging delivery and Uber drivers for idling. Continuing to facilitate Amazon and e-trade at the expense of local business will only hasten the death march. But sure, let's spend money on a white elephant of lamppost chargers. Good idea.

David Lesniak ● 21d

Possibly, I could never do it, with children they have things taken from them also their bike, 10 bike jackings a week, re BBC news.

Janice Evans ● 21d

>Children often have kit etc, it's not a case of just driving them around, we have to be sensible about these things.Was it you that was asking a while back how people on bikes carry shopping?

Paul James ● 21d

If you look at Zapmap, the lamp post chargers have nowceased to be competitive. Shell has taken over from ubitricity and SureCharge.The cost is 76p per kw.  But there are add on extras.The cost of fast chargers are 89p per kw.If you weigh up the hassle factors, occupancy of parking spaces and the fact they don’t work half the time, it’s not surprising people don’t bother with them.

Jackie Elton ● 21d

Children often have kit etc, it's not a case of just driving them around, we have to be sensible about these things.

Janice Evans ● 21d

>Most people who drive also cycle.Wrong way round I think Janice.I have a driving livence, I drove a car just once last year to rescue some people from a snowbound property in the middle of nowhere. Everything else I did was on a bike or public transport. I obviously depend on other people driving motor vehicles so I'm not for banning motor vehicles if you're going to suggest that of me, as is standard.Also, doesn't apply to anybody under 17, but the more of them who feel safe to cycle (and parents feel it's safe to let them cycle) the fewer will get driven around.Let's make roads 100% safe for cycling and walking please.

Paul James ● 21d

Most people who drive also cycle.

Janice Evans ● 21d

We can convert petrol stations to fast charging stations when (ideally before) the petroleum runs out due to Trump's war on the motorist or before we all get washed away by flooding and rising tides.Stop growing food for use in fuel and cover fields with solar power.Make roads and driving completly safe so more and more people feel safe enough to cycle if they can, including children.Change the model of "everybody drives to the supermarket every weekend for a massive shop".Less car use, more space for those that really need to drive, including delivery drivers etc...etc...

Paul James ● 21d

Your analogy with a shop selling newspapers is stupid. You have said yourself that you want fast chargers but you have your head in the sand about the reality of implementation.The electricity supply network is nothing to do with the council so you simply aren’t going to see a large numbers of fast chargers everywhere because the supply network can’t support it.And where power can be supplied, you are also ignoring the charger will either need to take pavement space or take away parking spaces. You refuse to acknowledge these challenges, so all you can do is whine, whine, whine about the council.

Michael Robinson ● 23d

Michael, you illustrate both the flaw in the proposal as well as the solution needed:"you can't magic up large increases in the electricity supply grid"More lamppost charges won't do this. Yet the increase in supply is what is needed to move the initiative forward to a more successful outcome.

David Lesniak ● 23d

Funnily enough I have read it. Long on wishful thinking, and short on any reality. Quintessential central planning mentality.  Full of what the Council would like to believe should happen, but short on observing how EV drivers are actually using charging points and what their preferences and behaviours are. If people aren't actually using these charging points or using them for only about 11% of the time (and that is optimistic) why keep installing more of them?  If I was running a shop selling newspapers and fewer and fewer people were buying them, would I simply stock more of them in the hope that people would buy them or would I recognise that people buy fewer newspapers any more and stock less of them. But that's not the Council's way.  "If we build them, they will come."  Sorry - that's not how it works. May be after a few million of public funds in investment and in about 20 years, they might see the light.

Jackie Elton ● 23d

You are still ignoring the realities of implemention - you can't magic up large increases in the electricity supply grid, shrink 50 kW rectifiers to fit inside lamp post columns and you are ignoring the question if you think pavement space or parking spaces should be lost for fast chargers.It may have escaped you there are over 90,000 vehicles a day using the A4, which is just a tad over the number of cars on a typical Chiswick street. Rather than your continuous whining about the council, why don't you actually read the Hounslow EV Charging Strategy document?

Michael Robinson ● 23d

Lamp post charging isn't cheap and charging costs vary according to time of day and which company you are using. Plus the stress and time taken using something that often doesn't work and is terribly slow. And it costs 10 times more than home charging. And prices have rocketed up in recent years. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c86e3nj3jgwoI don't see many people in these forums rushing to their defence from personal experience - and you only have to go to the BP station on the A4 to see how popular they are in peak times. The council has not produced any evidence on their popularity and usage and whether they are highly used compared to peole who need to park.  Listen to the market. I have had enough frustrations trying to use the damn things and I only use them as a last resort.

Jackie Elton ● 23d

I think we should all thank Michael for further evidence lamppost chargers are simply throwing good money after bad. So, then, how much is the council earning from the supplier of said useless chargers and how much is being lost by eliminating parking permits?

David Lesniak ● 24d

A quick check on Zapmap for locations in Chiswick shows that a 50 kW fast charger is over x10 the KWh price of a 5 kW lamp post charger so the fast charger works out more expensive - you are paying a premium for speed.Jackie Elton's "8 hours to 15 minutes" comparison means the fast charger is x32 the power of a lamppost charger or ~160 kW.There simply won't be 160 kW chargers on every street unless the entire electricity grid is upgraded.Then there is the reality of implementation.  There won't be space on the pavement for fast chargers on many Chiswick pavements so that means putting them on the road.  Cue howls of complaints about loss of car parking space.The electricity supply network for lampposts was built for lightbulbs, not charging EVs, plus there isn't room in a lamppost for rectifiers to do AC to DC conversion, that is why they are 5 kW.

Michael Robinson ● 25d

But do you pay more? I don’t think you are correct about that Jackie.https://www.which.co.uk/reviews/new-and-used-cars/article/electric-car-charging-guide/how-much-does-it-cost-to-charge-an-electric-car-a8f4g1o7JzXj#:~:text=Table_title:%20Typical%20electric%20car%20running%20costs%20Table_content:,79p%20%7C%20Cost%20per%20mile:%2025p%20%7CThat’s not to say that there aren’t plenty of pros with fast chargers, but cost isn’t one of them.Speed, reliability are advantages of fast chargers, and of course if you are breaking a long trip you don’t want a lamppost.But for my hybrid? I’d prefer the cheaper option, I don’t have to drive to get to a charger, can do it overnight and, if it doesn’t work, I still have the ICE option.

Andrew Jones ● 25d

How often do local faster chargers get fixed when they are out of service?

Philippa Bond ● 25d

You are right Philippa - so why on earth would one pay often more on a lamp post when it might take about 8 hours instead of 15 minutes. (quite often go wrong).  Its just so out of date. But Councils like Hounslow like it because they can claim they are fighting the climate emergency.

Jackie Elton ● 25d

Zapmap shows charger coverage has hugely increased since I last looked and I've noticed it especially in London and on motorways.  Shell and BP have updated some of their "petrol" stations to just EV charging. I only looked for those.  Shell has some arrangement with Ubitricity.  I understand the fastest type of chargers now can give a car 100 miles of charge in 15 min.  The world of who you sign up to charging with I've not investigated at all this time - one, more etc.  Other petrol stations have added EV charging points.  Plus ca change!

Philippa Bond ● 29d

There are now far more fast chargers or semi fast chargers available. For example on the A4 between Hammersmith and Chiswick. Very popular and they work. Because they are fast,eficient they don't occupy a parking space for up to six to eight hours. Not many EV drivers bother with the slow lamp post ones.

Jackie Elton ● 30d

We used to have lamppost EV charging points in our road but the all got waterlogged and stopped working. Has Hounslow sorted out this design fault now if they are installing them again?

Lucy Chambers ● 31d

What is more important to you? Fast charging or keeping parking spaces? Because it may not be possible to have both. You can see the photo below of the fast charger on Power Rd near Gunnersbury station which has been built on the road, reducing kerbside parking spaces.  Many Chiswick streets simply won’t have space on the pavement for this type of equipment hence building charging into existing lampposts.

Michael Robinson ● 31d

We have just responded to an consultation.  The EV drivers in our street including me, all prefer faster car charging options which we find more convenient and reliable and often even cheaper than the lamp post options. Also we prefer not to annoy our neighbours by hogging scarce and much needed parking spaces.  It is just seem to be the agenda of the Councils to promote the lamp post options so they can say they are doing something and also to reduce the number parking spaces. There is no evidence that they have actually done a study of how much the lamp post charges are actually being used - and how much revenue they are generating and what people actually think of them - that would actually be worthwhile research.

Jackie Elton ● 31d

As I pointed out earlier, Ealing council pulled out of the testing for pavement channels to hide the charging cable. Presumably they are on a backhander from the overcharging street charger suppliers!

Peter King ● 31d

There are people who leave their cars in charging bays even when they have finished charging (or there definitely used to be) especially when there were fewer EVs because they were more interested in making use of the parking space.There are also always some people who think that the parking space outside their home is theirs alone rather than just a part of the King's Highway that has to be shared.  Since you certainly can't fit more than one car (if that) in front of a house and parking is not allowed along all of every road this is still going to be contentious.It would be good if the VAT rate on lamppost was less than it is and closer to the reduced home electricity VAT.

Philippa Bond ● 31d

I'm not due for a car change for a few years but have been asking myself these questions as I'm presuming it would be an EV. I don't think my road is atypical and, while I don't get to park in front of my house every day, it is often enough that I would be able to regularly charge.  Doing the costings at the moment, if I can charge overnight on an off-peak tariff, I will save quite a significant amount per mile. However, if I was to have to use a lampost charger, the difference between an EV and an ICE vehicle is pretty limited.  Ealing borough seems to be going more for dedicated chargepoints as opposed to lamppost bays for now. Ironically, if they were to designate a bay outside my house, it would make me much less likely to switch to an EV.

Andrew OSullivan ● 31d

How often do you manage to park right outside your own home and how many car owners are there in your street?  How often do some of those cars move?  Many streets are just used as car parks with cars parked for weeks at a time when people fly off on holiday.

Philippa Bond ● 34d

"People expecting to be able to park outside their house with to charge their electric vehicle when those sorts of numbers hit are away with the fairies I think."I don't massively disagree - but as far as private chargers go, would it actually make any difference whether you have 10% or 90% of vehicles being electric vehicles?Why do I say this?You can only use your "personal" charger if you can park near it.No one else can use it ( unless there is some sort of co-operative arrangement - maybe that would be feasible, but it would be complicated)People like to park near where they live, whether they have ICE or electric cars.Just thinking aloud - no axe to grind!

Andrew Jones ● 34d

>I ( and I'm sure almost everyone else) accept that there will be a very slightly smaller amount of space for non-blue badge holders to be able to park in to improve the quality of life of blue badge holders.Totally, and I'd love to see more blue badge parking, especially near shops, have bays further away for people better able park a bit further away.Electric vehicles are another level though, we're playing around the edges with them, in norway where 90% of new vehicles are electric.People expecting to be able to park outside their house with to charge their electric vehicle when those sorts of numbers hit are away with the fairies I think. (not that I think it's a good idea society just swaps ICE cars with electric ones)

Paul James ● 34d

Yes I realise that and it's the same in LBHF as far as I can tell - what I meant was that I understand why places that only blue badge holders can park in are implemented near where the blue badge holders live, and support them being put in.I ( and I'm sure almost everyone else) accept that there will be a very slightly smaller amount of space for non-blue badge holders to be able to park in to improve the quality of life of blue badge holders.

Andrew Jones ● 34d

My sister has no charging points where she lives so was unable to purchase an EV, what an awkward situation for many.

Janice Evans ● 34d

>I support disabled only places in parking zones,FYI, blue badge parking like this is parking for any blue badge holder, it's not a reserved sapce for one blue badge holder, in ealing at least.

Paul James ● 34d

Janice,I doubt that would help matters. The people who might be parked on the road near your charging point could be ( in fact are likely to be) residents themselves, so you still wouldn't have any access to your own charging point if they are already parked there - they wouldn't need to clear the space by 8pm.I support disabled only places in parking zones, but if you do have a charger on your premises I don't think it's going to go down well with all the ICE vehicle owners in the street if parking outside your property is restricted to electric cars.

Andrew Jones ● 34d

If you don't have a driveway for home charging, maybe they should look at residents only parking after say 8pm so you could park.

Janice Evans ● 34d

>Thanks, Paul for ignoring what's happening in other London boroughs. Odd, but then again, to be expected from you.Odd, that some councils ahve decided across pavement charging is a bad idea (which it is, for many reasons) and don't allow it/aren't implmenting it in lieu of other more suitable charging options?>Not talking about phones, I'm not talking about phoens either, I'm talking about rechargable batteries.>Paul. But what the public wants and what the industry is headed toward.The public wants fast AND slow chargers. Fast when yuou need a fast charge, but ideally slow to preserve battery life.>As for the horses, I'm guessing it's the meds.I see horses on the road most days in London, I ride past two stables and past buckingham palace.>I'm guessing it's the meds. Odd, but then again, to be expected from you.Why so nasty David?

Paul James ● 34d

Many supermarkets have them now but you cannot use them overnight andnot sure if the parking limit applies if charging battery during the day.

Janice Evans ● 34d

"Well, there is in many case in london, as you're not allowed to have cables across the pavement"Thanks, Paul for ignoring what's happening in other London boroughs. Odd, but then again, to be expected from you. Not talking about phones, Paul. But what the public wants and what the industry is headed toward.As for the horses, I'm guessing it's the meds.

David Lesniak ● 34d

How useful it could be would very much depend on how someone uses their car.If you need to charge your vehicle every day then it wouldn't work very well, you are not going to be able to rely on using your charging facilities a lot of the time.For someone who uses their car infrequently/or works from home then it might work (unless you find that other cars regularly park in your road and don't move for days or weeks on end!).Yes, you would need to ensure all cables are safe and that electrical protection is mandatory - that would almost certainly mean cables wouldn't be left in situ, but only be present when connected to a vehicle.

Andrew Jones ● 35d

For Chiswick residents who are council tax payers in Ealing, our lovely council pulled out of the testing for channels in the pavement. Barstewards

Peter King ● 35d

Also, I saw a cross pavement charging installation in a photo a while back, it looked REALLY DANGEROUS with exposed cable both ends, not the wires, just the sheath, but if you have exposed cable ion the street Idon't think it's going to be long before you see the actual wires, it wouldn't take much. It would require regular inspection, all sorts of trips and breakers etc...

Paul James ● 35d

>I feel strongly that Hounslow Council should investigate cross pavement charging. At a time our Road is expecting replacement paving there is the opportunity to install gullies that will enable residents to charge their vehicle parked outside their house at domestic rates.I can't imagine this ever working. The idea of getting the same parking space outside your own house everyday on most london streets is ridiculous surely?

Paul James ● 35d

I feel strongly that Hounslow Council should investigate cross pavement charging. At a time our Road is expecting replacement paving there is the opportunity to install gullies that will enable residents to charge their vehicle parked outside their house at domestic rates. This is already a recommended practice for London Councils and is happening in other boroughs. https://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/news-and-press-releases/2025/electric-vehicle-revolution-hits-pavement-new-guidance-tackles-trip#:~:text=While%2090%25%20of%20EV%20users,with%20Kerbo%20Charge%20in%202024.Cross-pavement charging solutions can offer a practical fix. Using either a surface 'gully' or a system buried under the pavement, they allow charging cables from a home charge point to safely cross the pavement to an EV parked on the street.These installations are quick—typically completed within 1.5 to 3 hours—and blend into existing street materials to maintain safe pedestrian access.

Tony Bowden ● 35d

"Who want's to stop an spend multiple hours on the side of a road waiting for a charge?"Can't imagine anyone particularly wants to, and I can't imagine anyone does wait multiple hours, twiddling their thumbs. But, in a street where there in no off street parking ( like the section of my road where I live) there would be little point in someone installing their own private charging facility because a lot of the time you'll likely find someone parked on the road near your private charging facility, so you won't be able to use it.Would it be better to have 5 slow lamp post chargers or one fast charger in my road? In my road I reckon 5 slow lamp post chargers would be more useful to more people.There is currently a need for both types in my book, but it's a lot more difficult and expensive to install fast chargers on local roads ( and I think the kWh price of a publicably available fast charger reflects the increased costs as well as the convenience factor of faster charging  times)

Andrew Jones ● 35d

>Of course, Paul, there is nothing preventing a homeowner from installing whichever charging method they wish.Well, there is in many case in london, as you're not allowed to have cables across the pavement.>Begs the question why, then, do the public want speedy charging? Why is it a problem when planning a long distance journey? Who want's to stop an spend multiple hours on the side of a road waiting for a charge? Why did BO just completely overhaul a station on the A4 to fast charges? To name a few.Fast chargers are needed too. I actually have both for my phone, overnight I leave it on a wireless trickle, but if I need to charge it quickly I've got a change mode that will do it in 3/4 of an hour.>But thanks for the info about horses. Can't say I've run across any on the local roads, but you do you.I see horses on the roads ALL the the time, practically every day.

Paul James ● 35d

Of course, Paul, there is nothing preventing a homeowner from installing whichever charging method they wish.Begs the question why, then, do the public want speedy charging? Why is it a problem when planning a long distance journey? Who want's to stop an spend multiple hours on the side of a road waiting for a charge? Why did BO just completely overhaul a station on the A4 to fast charges? To name a few.But thanks for the info about horses. Can't say I've run across any on the local roads, but you do you.

David Lesniak ● 35d

>I think a better solution that requires nothing from the council is enabling residents to install charge points. Rather than, say, one on a road, in some areas you'd probably get at least a dozen or so cars now being able to re-charge more efficiently/effectively.Why slow charging is healthierSlow (AC) charging uses lower current, which means:- Less heat is generated, and heat is one of the biggest drivers of battery wear.- Gentler charging cycles reduce stress on the battery’s chemistry.- Lower overcharge risk, because the onboard charger can more precisely manage the final top‑off.This is why EV manufacturers and battery experts consistently recommend AC charging for routine use.

Paul James ● 35d

Thanks David.

Andrew Jones ● 36d

Andrew, the issue isn't the where. It's the how.There was a recent council initiative to adopt crossing the pavements safely with cables plugged in to a charge point mounted on a private residence. This required the installation of a channel flush with the pavement to bury the cable during a charge. All, I believe, at the homeowner's expense.  Parking wouldn't need to be restricted. And I'd like to think that your neighbors know who you are and would happily accommodate your parking to charge if need be. Granted this would work best on a street with mostly private residences. On my street we know who's car is whose and everyone falls into a defacto system of sorts.Meanwhile, if we join up the thinking, take a look at the pavements. They're often in dire need of repair. So if the council replaced paving stones and installed proper protected conduits it would be a win/win. A better investment of public funds in my opinion than spending anything on woefully inadequate lamppost chargers. The problem with the current proposal for installing conduits/raceways is there seems to be no ability for quality control of the works needed to install. That's just a liability disaster waiting to happen.Of course you also could install charge points in parking new parking facilities. The entire structure could be a charge center. Did that happen in Brentford? Probably not. So that's nine stories of parking without the ability to charge (of course Guy Lambert can weigh in with details - as a Green candidate he approved that parking facility). Did that happen in Hammersmith? Yes. Could it happen in Chiswick? Yes. If you require developers to provide bike racks, no reason you can't require developers who provide parking to install charge points.It would require ironing out how to keep them operational. The facility in Hammersmith stopped providing the service about the time there was a spike in electricity rates. There are very few points that remain useable. A huge loss of perfectly viable infrastructure.

David Lesniak ● 36d

David, I didn't say more wasn't better, I was simply trying to find out a bit more about what your "better solution" entailed.I asked:Would the resident installed charge points be installed on private land or on the (public) pavement or road? My assumption was that it would be on private land, but I'm not a mind reader so have no idea whether that's what you had in mind. I also asked:Would parking within reach of the charge points be restricted to the residents that installed the charge points?Simple questions, that should be easy for you to answer.What I read on Hounslow online site is that planning permission isn't needed if the charge point is more than 2m away from a public highway, and it can't be more than a certain size to be allowed under permitted development.If you don't want to answer some simple questions just say so.

Andrew Jones ● 36d

Of course, Andrew, you could always just research the options yourself. Councils are very much aware of them.In this instance, more is better. But you always seem to be satisfied with the bare minimum.

David Lesniak ● 36d

How would your better solution work David?Would the resident installed charge points be installed on private land or on the (public) pavement or road? Would parking within reach of the charge points be restricted to the residents that installed the charge points?

Andrew Jones ● 36d

Odd, then, Jeremy, you also read how major car companies are abandoning their EV efforts after having spent billions of (choose your currency). I think a better solution that requires nothing from the council is enabling residents to install charge points. Rather than, say, one on a road, in some areas you'd probably get at least a dozen or so cars now being able to re-charge more efficiently/effectively.Again, I see no point in facilitating something that seems increasingly obsolete. Why spend on something so slow ineffective? Interesting to see the box ticking going on. Even the press weren't alerted to this consultation. Really, on 28th March suddenly the press finds out about something with a deadline on 30th March? At the beginning of half term?Rotten. Labour. Again.

David Lesniak ● 36d

What is the kWh price on a ‘fast charger’ compared to a lamp post charger?

Andrew Jones ● 37d

David, despite what you may read in the press (the right wing press are hilariously biased against EVs), EVs sales are rising year on year both in absolute numbers and as a percentage of all new car sales.  In 2025 473,384 new EVs were sold in the UK which was a 23.4% market share.It would not surprise me if by the end of this year EV sales were 30% of the new car market particularly if petrol prices stay as high as they are now.Of course EV will not be for everyone's needs and it definitely helps a lot to have home charging, especially combined with solar power generation at home.  But it does seem reasonable to me that the Council roll out more lamp post charging for those who do not have off street car parking

Justin Stephenson ● 37d

https://www.electriccarscheme.com/blog/used-electric-car-prices-are-falling-fastIt's better than running a cable through a tree and up to a window as I've seen.  Or just having to keep it plugged in for hours and hours.

Philippa Bond ● 37d

Agreed, Sam.I'm guessing Philippa has never charged a car at any of the available types of chargers. Once she has, she'd be able to comment more effectively and actually compare/contrast the differences. I'm wondering if there are to be so many of them, will there be a need to dedicate parking spaces or just not bother?Because it seems odd to me if e-vehicle sales are falling and/or constantly fluctuating, why would a council dedicate space to one sole purpose?

David Lesniak ● 37d

Will everyone be allowed to use them, sometimes they are just for residents of the area they are in.

Janice Evans ● 38d

Hence my last sentence!  But how much better and faster are the others at being fixed when out of order - and showing on an app that they are out of order now so you don't find out when you get there?  They won't be as fast as a special fast charger elsewhere - because like everything tech it changes and usually improves and speed of charging is an important aspect for many - until they are faced with having to slow down for the sake of their health and everyone else's.

Philippa Bond ● 38d

The power supply to lamp posts is quite simply not adequate for rapid recharging. In addition the technology used had proved unreliable with a significant number of such charge points being "out of order".

Sam Hearn ● 38d

Isn't a mix necessary?  It took an awful long time to see electric chargers added to "petrol stations".  Nobody wants to be searching for fuel stations for whatever kind and it should help to reduce the number of cables trailed across pavements.  It will make it easier for residents and their visitors whether friends, carers, health visitors and repair people to top up.  The increasing use of mobile phone apps will help people to find them reducing anxiety and the knowledge of whether they are working and available.  I just hope there is a robust system for reporting and swiftly dealing with any that don't work wherever they are!

Philippa Bond ● 38d

Meanwhile, there's a consultation.Hounslow Cabinet didn't even let local councillors know about it. https://talk.hounslow.gov.uk/ev-charging-pointsDeadline 30 MarchLamp-post charging is pointless. Dedicated chargers much better at getting the job done.

David Lesniak ● 38d

Thanks for posting this as a lot of people wouldn't know about these plans I became aware through my street's Whatsapp group and a friend was aware through their Resident's Association.  Not everyone has that source of information.

Helen Whitman ● 39d