Forum Topic

Step-free at Turnham Green?

From TfL's press release: A further seven Tube stations will also undergo assessment for step-free access feasibility; they are Croxley (Metropolitan line), East Finchley (Northern line), Neasden (Jubilee line), Northwood (Metropolitan line) and Turnham Green (District / Piccadilly lines), as well as Colliers Wood and Tooting Broadway on the Northern line.Don't hang up your walking stick just yet, this isn't going to be quick.

Mike Smith ● 203d19 Comments

Working with and around old infrastructure is always going to be Heath Robinesque - just look at Crossrail, especially at Whitechapel.

Charlotte Kasner ● 197d

When there's so much knowledge on forums such as these, you have to wonder why TfL bothers employing its own engineers. Heath Robinson would be proud.

Mike Smith ● 198d

As I understand it track height can be adjusted to provide level boarding although this might be difficult at Turnham Green where it goes over a bridge. If memory serves, they seem to have managed to get level boarding on the platforms at Barons Court even though there is District on one side and Piccadilly on the other. Possibly the answer would be to end the compromise at Turnham Green and aim for one of the Piccadilly or District Line services to be level boarding and anyone requiring this could switch lines at Barons Court.

Francis Rowe ● 198d

In some stations where the train carriage floor is above the platform, they have installed a 'hump' on the platform so there is level boarding for some carriages.  No idea what the approach might be if the train carriage floor is below the platform other than asking for assistance with a ramp.

Michael Robinson ● 200d

OhI thought step free was being able to get to platform and not train being level with platform.Not sure that works with district and new piccawilly trains.Possibly a compromise between the two > No idea

Julian Pavey ● 201d

Yeah, to indulge in some completely uninformed back of the envelope designs, at Turnham Green I think they'd sink the lift shafts in the platforms so the entrances to the lifts were in the walls opposite the stairs to the platforms.However 'step free' is not the same as level boarding and that is a challenge at Turnham Green as Piccadilly line and District line trains are different so the platform height is a compromise.

Michael Robinson ● 201d

Can't post the image here for paid reasons but this link gives a good visual of the platform https://c7.alamy.com/comp/2X1K9H5/london-united-kingdom-june-29-2010-turnham-green-railway-station-underground-train-station-along-the-district-line-westbound-to-richmond-2X1K9H5.jpg

The stairs and the tunnel take you roughly to the last blue post/standup tube station sign past the seating. It is that area beyond, the hut that would be behind the wall opposite the stairs downstairs.
Repeated on other platform. What is in those huts, other stations don't have them.
Or is it something to do with the old station and footbridge

Julian Pavey ● 201d

At Gunnersbury, maybe there would be room for a lift right at the end of the platform at the corner of the steps and walkway to Grange Rd. With the proposed development, I think all the car parking will be gone but don't know what the plans are for the road between the two car parks. It doesn't look as if a platform will be restored so the capacity bottleneck of a single set of steps going to a single platform will still be there.

Michael Robinson ● 201d

Surely a lift fits in where the white huts are.You have the stairs,the hallway or tunnel sits below the seating area and the huts sit above whats behind the wall downstairs.Its only got to be big enough for say 4 people.Basicaly whats behind the shop kiosk and is below the platforms at the begining of the platform is traveling east from west.Ive on the odd occasion seen a station worker go into those huts early of a morning.Lift,barriers at side of platform.Does not look that hard in my eyes.

Julian Pavey ● 201d

That's good to hear. Still think Gunnersbury will be first though as to my untrained eye it looks less of a challenge in terms of space and it is more likely to get private sector funding.

Francis Rowe ● 201d

I was suggesting your easy-peasy fix is unlikely, not that step-free won't happen. TfL are more than capable of finding a solution, I'm sure, but it won't be on the basis of a back-of-a-fag-packet drawing. It'll take time, engineering expertise (from the sorts most will say are grossly overpaid etc) and money.What makes these station types stand out (in a bad way) is their embankment elevation and hemmed-in nature, but it has been done.As for the new rolling stock, they'll be akin to Porsches on British Leyland wheels without the (unfunded) signalling, so no gains to speak of.

Mike Smith ● 201d

If it is that cut and dried from an engineering perspective then TfL must know and therefore are wilfully misleading us. However, I'm not that much of a cynic to believe that. Somebody qualified to do so surely must have done an initial outline analysis before adding Turnham Green to the list on the basis that, even if it is challenging, it could be feasible.Trains going through stations where lifts are being installed isn't something that TfL will be unfamiliar with and, if the fast moving trains are an additional concern, the hours during which they stop could be extended during the works or, if that was not possible, work could take place at times when they were scheduled to stop. Won't the new rolling stock create a bit of slack in the timetable given the superior deceleration?

Francis Rowe ● 201d

Weasel words or not, I suspect the answer would stay close to:1. Money (there isn't any...unless the Govt are going to hand some over)2. A fully accessible and plentiful bus network

Mike Smith ● 201d

It's a relatively narrow island platform setup so, no, your engineering proposals won't work. There's also a steep embankment to deal with on both sides that back on to Wheelers and residential properties. Additionally, your suggestions would most likely need a full station closure for an extended period. Engineering in confined spaces is tricky enough, but add tons of fast-moving railway stock into the mix and it becomes something completely different, especially when much of that stock is coming from or going to Heathrow airport.

Mike Smith ● 201d

Couldn't you put the shafts opposite the stairs up to each platform in the tunnel or put the lifts where the stairs currently are and put stairs on the opposite side?

Francis Rowe ● 201d

The Mayor has a target.Perhaps he could then explain to the less able travellers in Ealing why there is only ONE  fully accessible platform on the Underground in the whole borough (two if you count Greenford) shameful.

N V Brooks ● 202d

Putting in lifts for the two island platforms at Turnham Green is a major engineering puzzle.

Richard Greenhough ● 202d

I'd bet Gunnersbury will be first as there should be money from the Chiswick Tower developer to part pay for it.Turnham Green should get priority but it probably won't due to it being at the border of the borough and no major developments nearby. Even so, if the Mayor wants to meet his target it will have to be done within six years.

Francis Rowe ● 202d

At least TfL will be doing the study. Northfields locals were asked to 'contribute' £200,000 towards any such study at that station.

N V Brooks ● 203d