Forum Topic

Removing historic mature London Planes on Fauconberg Rd

I've just had a flyer through the door from Hounslow Highways signed by Gary Winterbottom (Community Environment Officer) saying they will remove 'four of the large historic London Planes Platanus x hispanica'on Fauconberg Road on 9 May i.e. in 10 days time. The reason given is two of the trees 'have large cavities to the main trunk' (so presumably otherwise healthy) and two have 'fungal brackets around the base' and all have proximity to the highway (hence risk of falling onto the highway guess .... really??).  There is nothing mentioned about alternatives to felling them (for exampling reinforcing the base or treating the fungus) nor is there any time allowed for feedback or consultation. They point you to a generic 'general enquiry' form for Hounslow Highways if one has questions or concerns. Given the huge importance of mature trees to our community in so many ways, this feels awfully glib, ill considered, silo'd and unnecessarily rushed. But is there anything we residents and citizens can actually do to stop our undemocratic council from ramming yet another ill considered and damaging initiative through with no input at all from the community?? I'm appalled by this but don't want to waste my energy on another stupid fait accompli if that's what it's going to be.  Or we could chain ourselves to the trees .....????

Glenn Manoff ● 1607d24 Comments

To clarify having just had a look where the trees are, the risk isn't to them falling on the A4 just onto the houses / cars on Fauconberg Road. As I live in one of those houses  that's obviously a concern. But as the trees have been there well over 100 years it's hard to know if there's a serious risk of them falling anytime soon or if this is just over-cautious health and safety action. They've provided no info about the risk or the assessment

Glenn Manoff ● 1607d

At a time of severe financial contraints on Council funding, do you geneuinely think that LBH would needlessly spend time, trouble and money on a scheme like this, especially something which is generally unpopular with people (voters), in the run up to an election?I fear that your use of the term "undemocratic" reveals a prejudice against LBH regardless of what they do, even when it is something which could actually prevent a danger to you and your property. (It's hardly "undemocratic" when they were voted in last time, and could be voted out next time.)Meanwhile, two specific points from your second post:1. "But as the trees have been there well over 100 years it's hard to know if there's a serious risk of them falling anytime soon". Er, the older they are, the more likely they are to fall over.2. "They've provided no info about the risk or the assessment."Er, in your opening post you stated: "The reason given is two of the trees 'have large cavities to the main trunk...  ... and two have 'fungal brackets around the base' and all have proximity to the highway" - seems pretty clear to me.Meanwhile, I wonder what you response would be if they left the trees and one of them eg fell on your car?"Oh well, the main thing is that the tree was allowed to enjoy the whole of its natural life..."

Richard Cathcart ● 1607d

I have no particular knowledge about trees, but just because something is hollow, does not mean it is not strong. A scaffold pole is hollow but strong, as the middle contributes little to the bending strength of a tube/trunk. I do not remember seeing a tree that had snapped part way up the trunk. They usually fall because the roots are pulled out of the ground. I seem to remember either seeing on tv or reading that it was the natural life cycle of an oak tree to become hollow as maintaining that part of the tree was not greatly contributing to its health. None of this may apply here, but worth a thought.

Alan Green ● 1607d

Also not a tree expert as I don't even know what type of tree is in the photo.  I took this on the riverside path on the Kew side the day after the strong winds earlier this year.  This tree had snapped lower down on the trunk.

Michael Robinson ● 1606d

And this one happened in Ealing on South Ealing Road and luckily those walking along the street were unhurt!  Nothing it seems lasts for ever however much we'd  like it to.  A lot of trees fell diring the last high winds recently but this was not one of them.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-london-53310089

Philippa Bond ● 1606d

"At a time of severe financial constraints on Council funding, do you genuinely think that LBH would needlessly spend time, trouble and money on a scheme like this, especially something which is generally unpopular with people (voters), in the run up to an election?"Having seen other examples of LBH's stupidity, yes.

Richard Greenhough ● 1606d

At a guess, it will have been their insurers. Basically if their insurers won't insure trees with hollow trunks or fungal brackets around the base, then regardless of what anyone else says, then that's an end of the matter.While councils for their part presumably have a statutoryduty to maintain public liability insurance cover at all times.michael adams

Michael Adams ● 1606d

Thanks for all the replies. @Richard C your total faith in the competence and democratic leanings of our council is admirable but doesn't appear supported by their track record IMHO.  Re safety from dangerous tress it's a good point. If they have to come down so be it. But the hollowing at the base has presumably occurred over decades. Given the multifaceted importance of mature trees to our community and environment and their irreplaceability it seems reasonable to engage the community in understanding the facts of the report and exploring if there are any alternatives (supporting the tree base? treating the fungus? etc) before rushing to fell them with just over a week's notice and no opportunity for feedback or consultation.  Or perhaps I'm just a woke and reckless nimby as you imply @richard

Glenn Manoff ● 1606d

GM: "@Richard C your total faith in the competence and democratic leanings of our council is admirable but doesn't appear supported by their track record IMHO."Where have I ever expressed anything like "total faith" in  LBH? To answer my own question, I haven't - in fact had you asked me rather than making an assumption, I'd have agreed that LBH are a pretty poor council, all things considered.But I try not to pre-judge every situation, preferring instead to treat each case on its own merits.And in this instance, they have taken expert advice, likely reinforced by their insurers, as has been pointed out.Beyond that, if they have to "consult the communnity" on every single matter, including a specialist area like this where the general public lack the requisite expertise, then no dangerous tree would ever get felled until it was too late.Finally, there is a (thankfully small) number of people on this forum who, if you deign to disagree with them on somnething, automatically take it personally, and go on to attribute all sorts of perjorative views and opinions to you, without any evidence or justification.One recent example was Claire Moran - a repeat offender - who called me a "woman hater" solely because I disagreed with a female poster. Naturally enough, she neither provided any evidence of same or retracted this nasty slur, never mind apologised.I do hope you don't join their ranks.

Richard Cathcart ● 1606d

I agree it would be good to be able to get other opinions as I would hope that when trees are inspected there is no benefit to the person/company condemning the tree from those trees being cut down.  It is also worrying to hear of tree works being done in bird nesting season as the law is supposed to protect them against disturbance.I understand that a lot of these older and larger trees which we love and need for the environment and climate can become damaged by all the works to the utilities over the years and this can make them less stable.  If there is a storm when they are in full leaf they are more likely to be blown over.

Philippa Bond ● 1605d

I suppose you just need one 100 year old tree to be removed for reasons that not all agree are just, to gives some ammunition to doubt future decisions.

Maggie Dodge ● 1605d

The clip of a couple's car webcam film I posted earlier shows the South Ealing tree falling in front of them and nearly hitting another couple walking by it who just managed to move fast enough out of the way.  A girl crossing the road appears as if she is looking at her mobile didn't seem to notice it happening.

Philippa Bond ● 1605d

It might be worth searching for the LBH Tree Survey.  We had one done here in Chiswick Village (https://tinyurl.com/cvrltrees) which recommended a few trees that needed felling, a lovely cherry with a hollow centre right outside my flat.I think that I read somewhere that LBH had done or was doing the same thing.Sometimes, actually lots of times, we REALLY do need experts.

Martin Weaver ● 1605d

As with most things to do with people in positions of power.  They have experts, they have evidence, sometimes they still just do what they want to do.  The fact that we pay their wages is the bit that really hurts.

Maggie Dodge ● 1605d

They also have their jobs to do and decisions to make especially when they have been notified or know that there is a problem.

Philippa Bond ● 1604d

The garden next to one of the 3B blocks on Sutton Lane North lost a cherry tree in the gales one or two years ago. Another one was inspected and had to go. All on private land.  As I know nothing about aboriculture I do leave it to the experts.  The suggestion that the tree experts employed by or contracted to the Council make their decisions because the politicians have told them to is both ridiculous and offensive.

David McLoughlin ● 1604d

You are right David. The arboriculturists are employed by Hounslow Highways and of course politicians do not tell them what to do. HH are normally more interested in saving trees than taking them down. The head of the department first saw the fungus on one of the Fauconberg trees a few years ago and obviously at that time it was decided that it was safe. But decay grows.....HH have planted a lot of trees in the last year and are always looking to try and improve the environment. They have also seeded wild flower meadows. But of course the good citizens of Chiswick are always looking at ways of bashing the Council.  HH are a private company who won the tender to look after the network and as such are not part of the Council, although they are answerable to the Council. It will be sad though to lose those trees in Fauconberg Road.

Iris Hill ● 1603d

You are quite right, except for one important detail. I doubt the majority of people living in Chiswick share the same antagonistic attitude, and display it so partially.  Similarly, I would like to think that candidates in Thursday’s election who were confident in their own policies would gain more support over those who instead focussed on making misleading claims against their opponents.

Tom Pike ● 1603d

Well someone cut down a 100 year old healthy tree on the instructions of the Council, presumably. They do what they’re told to do and paid to do .

Maggie Dodge ● 1603d

It is always sad to lose trees.  Some of the worst offenders at cutting them down are new home owners and developers eager to make it easier (and cheaper) to build their dreams ignoring the many years they may have taken and do take to grow to a good size.

Philippa Bond ● 1603d

I love it when you see a wall which has been built eg with a hole in it to allow a tree to remain in place.  Something that you seem to see less and less of nowadays.  We should show them more reverence.

Philippa Bond ● 1602d

They must do a survey to make sure there are no nesting birds. It is nesting season and disturbing nests now is illegal. I would ask them for proof of this.

Siobhan Phelan ● 1602d

Most companies have had trouble with continuity of staff who work together due to the pandemic.  It wouldn't be surprising for their winter and spring work to be behind - and that is if they knew that there was a problem here.  A lot of pollarding seems to have been done late.  Yes, there is environmental law about disturbing nesting birds.  This will have to be weighed up against heavy branches in full leaf being blown down.

Philippa Bond ● 1602d

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/may/05/mud-water-to-help-nesting-migrating-birds-during-uk-heatwaveApparently we are expecting nine days of heatwave and swifts in particular woll be looking for mud and for building nests but all birds are likely to be looking for water in gardens so please fill those birdbaths!

Philippa Bond ● 1599d