Forum Topic

Why no comments?

I am astounded that there haven't been any comments about the appalling Sarah Everard case. It is sickening to hear some of the daft comments from Kit Malthouse (flag down a bus) to the Police and Crime Commissioner  for North Yorkshire saying, she (Sarah) 'should never have submitted' to being arrested. What planet are these people from? Not only are these men patronising, they are insensitive and insulting. And then today that plonker Johnson telling us how the criminal justice system is shot to pieces - no sh*t Sherlock! But then when you put a complete moron like Chris Grayling in charge what do you expect? There isn't one Magistrate's Court left in this borough, investigation of rape and domestic violence cases, let alone convictions is practically nil, and there are waiting lists over two years long and over to get cases to court. The police haven't been properly funded for years, the probation service was privatised, ditto the forensic science service, and wasn't that successful? These are dark days for all of us - especially women and girls, the police services across the country need to get their collective acts together and ensure that the vetting of applicants is rigorous. We have a proud tradition in this country of 'policing by consent' the actions of this man have upset that and then some. This is 2021, not Victorian England - no woman should feel nervous about going out after dark and no-one should ever, ever be blamed for the actions of vicious, perverted men.  

Vanessa Smith ● 1849d42 Comments

Every aspect of the story is extreme, and milked to the hilt; so maybe people are a bit suspicious.

Michael Brown ● 1849d

Johnson might find the police’s failure to act on violence to women ‘infuriating’, but it’s worth remembering that, as Mayor for London (with  Kit Malthouse his deputy) he was responsible for the Met.

Vivienne Cox ● 1849d

Twickenham Green set for vigil to remember UK women killed by men 1 October 2021  Yasmin Choudhury Follow @SW_LondonerA vigil to remember all of the women in the UK who have been killed by a man will take place on Twickenham Green on Monday. The vigil will be hosted by the Richmond branch of the Women’s Equality Party (WEP) at 6pm on 4 October. Attendees are asked to gather by the memorial bench for Amélie Delagrange, who was murdered by Levi Bellfield and found on Twickenham Green.To date this year, 109 women in the UK have been murdered by men, which averages three every week. Head of campaigns for Richmond WEP, Jill Lorimer, said: “Our point is that male violence towards women needs to be something that the police, press, and politicians talk about every day.“When Sarah Everard was murdered, the press got very agitated about it, the politicians got very agitated about it.“They ran the story for several weeks, and lots of promises were made and men were committing to changing their behaviour. “But nothing actually happened, none of the promises were fulfilled.“If you can imagine three men a week being murdered by women, I think people would be getting a little bit more agitated about it.“So whilst we believe that every single instance is a tragedy and should get as much awareness as any other because they’re all as important as each other, we want to draw attention to the big picture.“This is a social epidemic where men think it is okay to be violent towards women.”The campaigner also confirmed that Richmond branch leader, Caroline Rayfield, will be giving a speech at the vigil.The party will now hold a vigil on the first Monday of every month for the foreseeable future. Richmond WEP held its first vigil on Twickenham Green on 2 September, where there was a small police presence. Lorimer said the police were a discreet presence and explained that they were there to protect the attendees rather than enforce crowd control.The police also made themselves available if anyone wanted to talk to them about domestic violence. In their fight to end male violence against women, Richmond WEP successfully campaigned for Richmond Council to become White Ribbon Accredited.White Ribbon UK is a charity that aims to end male violence towards women by engaging with men and boys to take a stance against the violence.This involves talking in the workplace, to other men, and to women, about how violence towards women is unacceptable.Find out more about the vigil or confirm your attendance here.

Vanessa Smith ● 1849d

If only women would stop giving birth to males..

Michael Brown ● 1849d

The last comment deserves no response. In my experience the police react very speedily to domestic violence calls, but random attacks are almost impossible to police. It is vital that all public routes are well lit with plenty of through traffic, and with taxis readily available. With regard to police vetting, it is shocking that this man already had a history of indecent exposure yet he wasn't suspended. In sex cases small crimes inevitably lead to larger ones.

Mandy Waters ● 1849d

The problem of male violence against women needs to be addressed urgently. Both the problem itself, and the often inadequate police response, appear to have their roots in misogeny. It's the enabling psychology that troubles me more than the sheer numbers. The number of murders of women is not greatly different from those of young black men, and, given that young black men constitute a much smaller percentage of the population, one can argue that they are far more at risk than women.After all the Conservative government cuts to funding of the police and courts, it is outrageous of Boris Johnson to lay the blame for violence against women on the failings of the criminal justice system. It's almost as if he feels that the slate was wiped clean when he became PM, and that he doesn't have to answer for the sins of his predecessors.As a further thought, how can Cressida Dick stay as Metropolitan Police Commissioner? She's been involved in just too many scandalous events. There was the killimg of Jean-Charles Menezes in an operation she was leading. There was the wholly insensitive response to the women's vigil for Sarah Everard on Clapham Comon, where the orders came from the top, and where she refused to criticise the excessive force used by officers. More recently she has been criticised in the report on police corruption that shielded the killers of the private investigator, Daniel Morgan. She is accused of obstructing access to vital documents.  It's a fine record!

Robert Fish ● 1849d

What annoys me is our streets have not been safe for women to go out alone of an evening, and impossible to get a cab to take you to your doorbecause of the new road designs.

Janice Evans ● 1849d

Taking absolutely nothing away from the horror of the Everard case (or that of Sabina Nessa), but while more obviously needs to be done to prevent this sort of outrage, neither should we allow such cases to distract us from also addressing another scandal.That is, 3 women/girls are murdered every week in Britain and we barely know their names. That is because 92% of women are murdered by someone known to them, usually victims of so-called "domestic" violence.So that even if we were to eliminate every Everard- or Nessa-style murder, we'd still have an enormous epidemic of violence on women and girls to address.(And I feel compelled to add that this is NOT a choice between preventing "domestic" murders or "stranger" murders - each needs to be addressed, and urgently.)

Richard Cathcart ● 1849d

Couldnt agree more!

Robert Fish ● 1849d

Due to my age, 71 years, I clearly remember the attitude of the Police towards women who reported violence to them by women from their husbands/partners  which was classified as "it's a Domestic" thus very little, or worse nothing, was done to protect these women. Sadly I believe that there's still some of that attitude prevalent within law enforcement and government. Why has it taken so long and so many deaths or serious injuries to women for the likes of BJ et al to take these issues seriously and be proactive rather reactive ?Well said all the previous posters.

Loraine Pemberton ● 1849d

It is awful when anyone is attacked in private or in public, and the chance of that happening in public is slim, but horrific when it happens.The vast majority of attacks on women do not happen outside, but indoors.The chance of a man being attacked or assaulted in public is far greater.None of that negates the seriousness of an assault when it happens.

Keith Iddon ● 1849d

In your eagerness to blame LTNs, you are overlooking that Sarah Everard was abducted as she was walking along the South Circular, and Couzens relied on a car and a fast getaway to carry out his crime. Violent crime is lower in LTNs.

Tom Pike ● 1849d

I notice Scotland introduced a new verification process if stopped by a lone policeman yesterday. Nothing here though apart from a stopping a bus. However as Kevin Maguire regularly says on GMB we are the dis United Kingdom.

Nicholas Beard ● 1848d

Wasn't the 'vigil' taken over by political extremists who had no intent on the calm silence of thoughtful remembrance? As this sad story has progressed the case against Misogyny appears to have veered violently toward Misandry when one reads, for example on social media, a suggestion that there should be a curfew for all men during the dark hours.

Bobbie Carnegie ● 1848d

"Wasn't the 'vigil' taken over by political extremists who had no intent on the calm silence of thoughtful remembrance?". Where on earth did you read this travesty of the truth?

Robert Fish ● 1848d

Probably there will always be the odd bods who want to try and use a public demonstration for their own ends, similarly daft suggestions of a curfew for men  - but this latest tragedy has shaken the establishment to its core. It isn't about just saying we will conjure up more police, it is about the attitude of a lot of men, and thankfully they are a minority, towards women in general. I hate the phrase - bit it is true a change in 'culture' is at the heart of this, and that isn't going to happen overnight. It's even the case that medical trials and drugs dosages are skewed towards men, which can affect treatments for various things, that's just weird, when 50% of the population are female. On top of that there are the appalling stats for prosecuting rape cases, and the treatment of the women who are brave enough to report it. Now we have the crisis in the justice system, which will delay cases for years not just for these cases, justice delayed is justice denied they say. Just imagine the trauma caused by having to rake up all the horrible details of an attack when so much time has passed, and then to have to be treated as if you were the perpetrator and not the victim, which does not happen in any other type of case. Not one Magistrates Court left in this borough now either. We perhaps have to look to our education system and ourselves to make a start where the male view of women is formed, and I say that as someone who has two sons and is a governor at a boys school. Really it is about respect for women as people not objects.

Vanessa Smith ● 1848d

I agree with everything you say, Vanessa, except your opening phrase, which appears to be making a partial concession to Bobby Carnegie's woefully wrong comment. I reiterate that in no way was the vigil taken over by political extremists with no intent of calm remembrance. The peace was disturbed by the heavy-handed police intervention, in marked contrast to the stand-off approach they adopted to other demonstrations during lockdown e.g. BLM, Reopen.

Robert Fish ● 1848d

Are those poo-pooing me and my ccontribution be okay that candlelit vigils have vigilists chanting and holding placards?

Bobbie Carnegie ● 1848d

Ok. I understand you have a problem with outspoken feminists. To suggest that the vigil was taken over by militant protesters is a travesty of the truth.

Robert Fish ● 1848d

Even for you Janice, that is a dim, thoughtless and distasteful comment.

Carl Wynne ● 1848d

Why is the suggestion that men should stay off the streets any more laughable than the more frequent suggestion that women should stay indoors 'for their own protection'?  Until men modify their behaviour, there'll be no answer to the fear and anxiety that many women must feel in their presence.

Peter Evans ● 1848d

Well then Carl, if that's your opinion of Janice's post, you are evenly matched.

Loraine Pemberton ● 1848d

"Really it is about respect for women as people not objects."Well said Vanessa

Loraine Pemberton ● 1848d

We as a society are responsible for the levels of violence and abuse we allow.  If you elect representatives who speak violently when describing others then you will see the effects in everyday life. Look how the language of Bolsonaro, Trump, Putin, Johnson, Orban and many more.  They do not use respectful language when talking about individuals or groups in their own societies. If children see this at home and in school every day of their lives then that violence is normalised and the misogyny begins.  If you reduce women to what they wear or how they look then they will be demeaned and abused.  If you refer to them as "post boxes" you dehumanise them. If you do this in front of a child who also sees physical violence regularly you teach a child the only outlet for anger is violence and control then you have made a potential rapist in a boy and a potential victim in a girl.

Caroline Carney ● 1848d

Exactly Peter ~ Misogyny and Misandry as it's always been with the notion of what's male and what's female battling it out. Meanwhile, feminists and chauvinists continue to vie for supremacy ~ elsewhere gender dysphoria sees boys wanting to be girls and girls wanting to be boys has school playgrounds buzzing like they never buzzed before.

Bobbie Carnegie ● 1848d

Treating misogyny and misandry as if they were equal threats to society is a false equivalence. Do women learn by example to be violent towards men? Is there a culture of misandry amongst women police officers? How many women are attracted to violent pornography?

Robert Fish ● 1848d

Actually Carl the problem was highlighted by a forum member who saidshe had to walk some distance to meet the cab because he would notdrive within the LTNs, with the same problem when she return home and had to walk some distance, so it's a fact.

Janice Evans ● 1848d

What about Sadik Khan. Does he not get a mention or is this just your usual Boris Johnsonbashing.

James Dow ● 1848d

A rather feminine answer if I may say so Mr Fish. I'm reminded of male sea horses that take from Mummy Seahorse newly hatched seahorselings to be nursed in Daddy Seahorse's stomach pouch for the purpose while Mummy Seahorse practicing a kind-of polyandry goes off in search of a new Daddy Seahorse to galavant about with.

Bobbie Carnegie ● 1848d

I wonder what seahorse tastes like....

Simon Temple ● 1848d

I should have realised that sensible discussion with you would be impossible.

Robert Fish ● 1848d

How dare you.

Simon Temple ● 1848d

Loraine, I'll add you to the dim, thoughtless and distasteful list.

Carl Wynne ● 1848d

Back to the actual reason for the original posting, what do we need to do as a society to stop women being killed. 81 women have been killed, allegedly by men, since Sarah Everard was abducted and murdered. Most of these murders go unreported. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/oct/02/the-81-women-killed-in-28-weeks

Mandy Waters ● 1848d

Is female dysphoria (female to male) a kind of self-misogyny?

Bobbie Carnegie ● 1848d

Doesn't that just mean misery?

Simon Temple ● 1848d

practising

Anne England ● 1848d

Mandy women are attacked during the day and also while at home, myparents always made me aware of the dangers although almost got caught out once by someone I knew, it's very difficult, personally I don't go outafter dark, never walk in lonely areas and be aware of who is around you.Thing is when  we are within our local area we tend to feel safe while out and we are not so always be aware of where you are going, not being able to park nearby many places has made it a little more difficult to stay safe and why I drive to places with parking.

Janice Evans ● 1847d

Oh and had a peeper around my home at one time, keep blinds down and curtains drawn of an evening so no one can watch you from outside.

Janice Evans ● 1847d

"If you elect representatives who speak violently when describing others then you will see the effects in everyday life."So how do you feel about politicians who call their opponents "scum" ?

Richard Greenhough ● 1847d

CarlI thought I'd been on that list of yours for years 🤣🤣🤣

Loraine Pemberton ● 1847d

Is Carl really Ko-Ko ? "As some day it may happen that a victim must be foundI've got a little list — I've got a little listOf society offenders who might well be undergroundAnd who never would be missed — who never would be missed!There's the pestilential nuisances who write for autographs All people who have flabby hands and irritating laughs —All children who are up in dates, and floor you with 'em flat —All persons who in shaking hands, shake hands with you like that —And all third persons who on spoiling tête-á-têtes insist —They'd none of 'em be missed — they'd none of 'em be missed![Chorus]He's got 'em on the list — he's got 'em on the list;And they'll none of 'em be missed — they'll none of 'em be missed"

Richard Greenhough ● 1847d