Forum Topic

Pardoning oneself

I read an article saying that Trump might try to pardon himself. I told my family about it, and we all shook our heads in dismay about the idea that that might be even possible in any sensible democracy. At which point my wife pointed out that, while it’s probably not possible for the president to pardon themselves in the US, and if he tries it’d be hotly contested in law, it is definitely possible for the queen to pardon herself, and would be very hard for anyone to contest. In fact, she apparently can’t even be prosecuted in the first place unless she decides to prosecute herself (not that I'm a constitutional expert).I don’t know her that well, but I’m doubting that our current queen will take advantage of this loophole (e.g. by murdering me for writing this post, and then pardoning herself).But since the topic of the weaknesses in democratic systems that we had previously considered very secure is rather pertinent in this day and age, that does seem to be a loop-hole that we should close. The alternative is having to just cross our fingers and hope that one of our future monarchs doesn’t turn out to be a nutter.

Simon Pedley ● 2122d8 Comments

If he's unable to pardon himself, Trump could always sep down with a week to go before the 20th January. Pence would therefore become president and offer Trump his pardon.That said, presidential pardons only applies to Federal crimes and not State crimes - so even with a pardon, New York State could still go after him.

Paul Scullion ● 2122d

AFAIK the presidential pardon only applies to offences against the United States.  It doesn't apply to an offence against a state as it is the "people of the State of ....." who contest the case in those circumstances.

Michael Robinson ● 2122d

Given that the monarchs role is purely ceremonial & the income they derive from both the civil list and their estate(s) is of sufficient magnitude so as to make them trying to further monetise their position for personal gain vanishingly unlikely, I'm struggling to think of a crime they're likely to commit, so I think the point is moot. Unless of course we wish to make dining at Pizza Express an offence.

Huw Burford-Taylor ● 2122d

Huw, You seem to think that people only commit crimes for the money, and hence that rich people don't commit crimes.And also that rich people don't want more money.I don't believe any of those are true.

Simon Pedley ● 2122d

No. I am saying that a *constitutional monarch* would be *highly unlikely* to commit crimes for personal material gain. I suggest you look up the difference. Whilst you're at it you also may want to consider that the reference to Pizza Express might just suggest that my tongue was in reasonably close proximity to my cheek.

Huw Burford-Taylor ● 2122d

The resignation before the inauguration ploy has been in the air for a while. There is a suggestion that Pence has refused to go along which might explain the sudden hostility towards him from some Trump staffers.It is very difficult to see how, without a pardon, Trump will avoid being in suit to match his skin colour by the end of the year.The other rumour I heard is that Trump plans to be in Scotland playing golf on the day of the inauguration. Time to ban arrivals from overseas! Maybe he plans to claim political asylum from his friend Britain Trump.

Mark Evans ● 2122d

Nicola S has already put paid to that idea, stating golf is not an essential activity: he won’t be let in.

Vivienne Cox ● 2122d

Princess Anne has been prosecuted for speeding three times, perhaps the Queen did in her younger days as well?

Andrew Jones ● 2122d