Forum Topic

Heathfield Terrace traffic lights

Looks like yet another set of specially frustrating traffic lights at the junction of Heathfield Terrace and CGT. While queuing outside the post office this lunchtime I had time to notice the unusually long queue of traffic in Heathfield waiting to join CGT. I then noticed they had barely five seconds of green to make progress. It also looks as if the lights are now three-way, allowing the eastbound CGT traffic to go first and then the westbound, but not both at the same time, and then the pedestrians and maybe a slot for cyclists. Oh, and then Heathfield, oops, too late, you've had your five seconds!  Once upon a time , I thought traffic lights were designed to improve traffic flow, not to frustrate it.

Peter Evans ● 2146d13 Comments

Peter, I have been warning some time that the whole point of the new bus gate and changes to light phasing is to throttle traffic and limit the amount that can reach the central stretch of the High Road. TFL know how severe the congestion on the High Road will be under the new layout and are desperate to keep buses moving, albeit very slowly.So the price the rest of the community pay will be permanent queues of traffic at either end of the High Road, including the roads around Turnham Green such as Heathfield Terrace and Sutton Lane. Walking and cycling on those roads will also be much less pleasant, but again TFL does not seem to care.Much traffic will be forced to use the Acton Lane to South Parade route, creating more queues and pollution there. TGT being open does little to improve things given the extremely short green phase. So the choice will be closing it and adding to queues on South Parade, or keeping it open and having long queues on TGT itself.Trying to get north of Chiswick today from Sutton Court Road was awful. Long queues around the green and up Sutton Lane, lots of horns honking and people doing U turns. Welcome to the brave new world of TFL and Hounslow.

Paul Green ● 2146d

Somebody is going to have to help me here. I'm trying to visualise  this but for the life of me I can't work out what CGT stands for!

Bruce Hammal ● 2146d

Of course I meant CHR, not to be confused with TGT, or SCR or indeed the SCR/NCR. It's CHR that seems to be hosting the festival of frustrating traffic lights.

Peter Evans ● 2146d

I presumed that's what you meant! I just wanted to be sure there wasn't a secret road I hadn't yet come across  in my 40+ years of living here. After all until the flower market showed up I had no idea the space in front of the George IV and the parade of shops was called "Old Market Place". My first reaction was to think it was a marketing ploy, though I see Google Maps has that name. Anyway - sorry for the digression - thanks for clarifying.

Bruce Hammal ● 2146d

The new light phases and bus gate are doing what they are designed to do. Throttling back traffic to stop the central section of the High Road becoming gridlocked. The price is near gridlock on all approach routes. TFL is intentionally pushing traffic onto side roads and residential roads.I would suggest anyone who lives in the area or has an interested in CS9 (pro or anti) have a look at these in action. Yesterday congestion was awful, probably by early afternoon today it will be similar. Traffic is bypassing the High Road from Chiswick roundabout to Acton Lane due to the bus gate, either using the A4 and coming up Heathfield Gardens, or cutting down onto Wellesley and up Sutton Lane.

Paul Green ● 2146d

But Paul, according to the front page news story, as soon as the cycle lane is in operation by this Friday, all the gridlock will disappear and settle down according to TFL. Even with new and improved traffic signals, how this is going to happen I have no idea, but then again, maybe by Friday, all the traffic will have dissipated for good as many people keep saying is what will happen with these schemes. Can't see it myself. I just watch the near permanent gridlock on CHR from Goldhawk road every day now, but maybe with new traffic light phasings this will all completely and miraculously disappear. I shall wait with baited (coughing from fumes) breath

J Morse ● 2145d

I think TfL's optimism that all will be well is based on the assumption that traffic levels will fall because of the schools being on holiday. They are possibly falling into the trap of believing that traffic is much better during the school holidays due to people driving their kids to school; that doesn't help but the main reason is that a significant proportion of people will be off work and away. For this Christmas more people will be around.TfL were probably hoping for a brief honeymoon period in which low traffic levels demonstrated how seamlessly the cycleway worked. The Sutton Court Road closure may have thwarted their aims.There is probably reason for scepticism that the cycleway will open on Friday. Like the rest of you I'm scratching my head and trying to work out how these traffic lights could be made to work without bring the road to a standstill on every day but Christmas Day.

Francis Rowe ● 2145d

Here's an idea. Perhaps the able bodied get out of their cars for local journeys and stop polluting our town?

John Hall ● 2145d

John, a very large proportion of traffic in the morning and evening peaks is construction, trade, delivery and other commercial serving customers across W4 and beyond. How do they get out of their vehicles.Not all are able bodied or with children and other needs may feel the need to use a vehicle, could be their own or Uber.On the broader point, I agree that through traffic from the M4/ A4 corridor that routes through Chiswick should be discouraged. At present, there are no plans to address this, which probs needs some form of congestion charge to be truly effective. Between 5-10 thousand people live north of the tube lines, the only viable route now is up Sutton Lane to Acton Lane in both directions. The High Road is so slow that even when TGT is open its not a viable option for many.The comments from TFL on the front page are a joke. The new bus gate was not in the original plans, its only function is to hold traffic back to prevent standstill on the central stretch of High Road. The queues we see are as intended.Try Google maps and see that if you are coming from Kew Bridge, Brenford, south Ealing or the A4/ M4 corridor and aiming to get north of the tube lines, from Bath Road to the Acton borders. It will direct you either from the A4 up Heathfield Gardens, or from Chiswick Roundabout via a short stretch of the High Road onto Wellesley Road, then up Sutton Lane. For context, other big drivers of A4 and W4 traffic are local sports events (Chelsea, Fulham, Brentford and QPR) plus Heathrow. Heathow is empty at present, as are the stadiums.Remember, like a dog, 'temporary' CS9 is not just for Christmas. We are stuck with it for years until the pollution and congestion force a rethink

Paul Green ● 2145d

John, that is wishful thinking.What would your estimate be of the proportion of traffic stuck in congestion in Chiswick that is made up of an able bodied driver who could have reasonably have taken a bike or walked as an alternative? Under normal circumstances I would say it would be quite low but right now, given that everyone in Chiswick knows that driving on the High Road will result in significant delays, the chances are that most journeys will be non-optional and that even many of those most wedded to their cars will be looking at alternatives.

Jeremy Parkinson ● 2145d

70%? The vast majority in the mornings I observe are non commercial vehicles, single occupant, below retirement age. 

John Hall ● 2145d

Some of the journeys being undertaken by car/van can't be undertaken another way but equally I'm sure there are plenty of people driving in cars in the morning who could find another way to get to where they are going. Once the threat from COVID has abated, it will be interesting to see how many people do return to using public transport, and how many choose to continue to endure the increased congestion that they are themselves partially responsible for.

Andrew Jones ● 2145d

John, the total proportion of car journeys on Chiswick High Road is probably below 70% so for your analysis to be correct 100% of these would need to be unnecessary.I looked at the most recent DfT numbers for the A315 and that suggested the combined proportion of cars and taxis was a bit over 70% However, the latest ONS data on traffic in London is that 40% of car journeys in central London are taxis and private hire vehicles and 15% in outer London.Chiswick has a relatively low level of car use by London standards but lets assume that it the use of taxis is at the outer London average, that gives you around 60% of vehicles on Chiswick High Road as private use cars. TfL numbers quoted by the BBC state that 35% of car journeys in London are under 1.2 miles only 14% under 0.6 miles. I think that it is reasonable to assume that a 2.4 round walk to the shops is at the limit of what could be expected. Maybe a bit more for bikes but by this stage you would be outside of the environs of Chiswick.Therefore only 21% of total journeys on Chiswick High Road would fall into your category of those that could potentially be replaced by walking or cycling even assuming a trip that would be greater than just popping to the shops. Looking again at the DfT figures these suggest that around 60% of car journeys include more than one person. So all passengers would need to be fit willing and able to walk and cycle.Of this remaining 21% you would need to exclude journeys where the driver or passenger are of limited mobility or a smally child, journeys which are being made for business purposes, journeys in which something is being bought or collected which would be too heavy, trips being made by carers, trips being made with a pet, trips being made in which something was being transported that couldn't be exposed to the elements. I don't think it is reasonable to assert that by the time you exclude all the reasons why a person legitimately might take a short trip in a car that you would be left with a proportion of non-essential short car journeys that would be more than low single digits as a proportion of the total.Right now everyone in Chiswick is area that the High Road is consistently congested so it is a reasonable assumption that a lot of short hop journeys are being postponed or substituted so the current number will be even lower.Of this remainder a proportion will be people who genuinely are so wedded to the car that no incentive on earth would make them change their ways. I'm sure we all know people like this but thankfully these days they are few and far between.The argument that Chiswick could be saved from the current traffic chaos by people changing their mode of transport seems to have no basis in fact whatsoever. Even if we had world class cycling facilities and pedestrian safety measures this wouldn't happen.

Jeremy Parkinson ● 2145d