Forum Topic

High streets will die if green roads revolutions bans cars warns retail expert

Excellent article in the Sunday Telegraph today by Steve Bird. Retail property investor Marcus Langlands Pearse, whose property portfolio includes the Maltings in Salisbury which was badly affected by the 2018 Novichok attack, cites research showing the high street is facing a perfect storm caused by online shopping and people shunning local shops because of fewer parking spaces, fear of being fined for driving on newly closed roads and traffic jams.“If you do not act immediately, you will find the result will be irreversible. I know this will be an extremely difficult internal decision but for the sake of these boroughs, for the sake of the residents and more importantly for the sake of the beleaguered retailers, someone has to raise a hand and show strength by reversing this decision." Full article here - sorry it's behind a pay wall: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/10/31/high-streets-will-die-green-roads-revolutions-bans-cars-transport/

Joanna Biddolph ● 2189d63 Comments

Chiswick High Road is a dogs dinner of a shambles. There is no shelter on any of the 'new' bus stops now, the traffic was horrendous and solid when I was out at about 1pm and yet again, an ambulance trying to go East just couldn't move as bus lanes have been sacrificed for cycle lanes. I just hope nobody needs an ambulance in a hurry as it can't move on Chiswick High Road. And before anyone says 'the cars are the traffic' and all the usual rubbish that comes with it - it is becoming a mecca for pollution  - which wouldn't be there if we didn't have the road ruined (IMO). I rarely use the car and am lucky to be able bodied and use public transport, but it is really an unpleasant place to be now and even with lockdown looming, am shying away from visiting it.

J Morse ● 2189d

All this and the anticipated disastrous impact of a no-deal Brexit will badly affect our High Streets. Your views are clear on LBHs recent changes to the roads which, I agree , seem to impacting negatively on retailers. Do you also accept that Brexit is a double whammy for them too?

Stewart Jones ● 2189d

I hope you bring this article to Hounslow’s attention in fact all councils and get the government to instruct councils to reverse all stupid schemes that are badly designed, killing high street trade and clearly not working.

Jayne Thorburn ● 2189d

And yet the stories rejoice in Brexit which has no design at all, is bad for business and will cause chaos.

Stewart Jones ● 2189d

The Tories, not the stories. Lol.

Stewart Jones ● 2189d

Jayne, You can be sure I will - and a lot more than that, too.

Joanna Biddolph ● 2189d

You believe what you read in the Telegraph?. Although the sports results are generally fairly accurate.

Ken Munn ● 2189d

It would be an excellent opportunity to make public your data on the immediate nosedive in sales the shops suffered when the parking was removed on TGT in early May. This is important given the particular focus of the Sunday Telegraph's article, the recovery of Salisbury after the 2018 Novichok poisionings. Salisbury is rather different to Chiswick, with a high proportion of customers arriving by car from rural areas very poorly served by public transport. In contrast the vast majority of customers to TGT do not come by car. It's not clear how the lessons learned would read over directly.Your data would therefore be important in quantifying the importance to retail of those travelling by car to shop on TGT, despite their low absolute numbers.

Tom Pike ● 2189d

The prevarication by the Government over the last few weeks about a circuit break has almost certainly increased the length of the lockdown now required. I’m afraid that Johnson is literally behind the curve again. It’s funny how often leaders in big trouble repeat previous mistakes. Whether you think loss of parking is a key factor in high street health or not, I’m afraid tthis mistake is going be at least an order of magnitude more costly.

Edward Seaton ● 2189d

It’s like University Challenge. Are you with Cambridge & Imperial or Kings College & Oxford reading of the data?

Russell Pearson ● 2189d

RP > "Are you with Cambridge & Imperial or Kings College & Oxford reading of the data?"It's a worldwide pandemic, not just a UK problem.Unsurprisingly, there are scientists and health experts from all over the planet investigating the virus and its effects.The international response is remarkably similar across the globe: variations on lockdown: arguably the most strict seemingly the most successful.

John Whitworth ● 2189d

Not just retail is affected, a friend of mine who has a problem walking long distances took the bus on Saturday evening at 6pm from Gunnersbury to Turnham Green.  It took 35 minutes to reach his destination.  I do not see how having 24 hour cycle lanes when hardly anyone is using them makes much sense, especially if stops public transport users getting around.  I am a car driver and the target of these measures, but it seems to have targeted a lot more people than just car users.  The negative effect on retailers and bus users was entirely predictable but they still refuse to back down.

Rahman Hyatt ● 2189d

Would you have a go at answering my question?

Stewart Jones ● 2189d

From the tabloids, but you can check out what they’re saying in more detail if you wishhttps://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/boris-johnson-handed-blueprint-plans-22939529https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8900897/Oxford-experts-DR-TOM-JEFFERSON-PROFESSOR-CARL-HENEGHAN-reveal-blueprint-handed-Boris-Johnson.html

Russell Pearson ● 2189d

Some might froth at the Telegraph, but the Guardian will pick this up in a couple of weekshttps://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/10/30/covid-19-rates-not-surging-reveals-kings-college-research/

Russell Pearson ● 2189d

"Salisbury is rather different to Chiswick"Alas, poor Tom, this is irrelevant.Thank yourself for that.Every single time any other area was cited by you for your agenda and it was pointed out that it was different to Chiswick (Walthamstow comes to mind, Green Lanes, etc.) you flatly refused to acknowledge said difference was pertinent. Localism. Lived experience of local traders and community. The solution lies there. In your very own backyard. The experience of traders who have been at it, in some instances for generations, is far more pertinent and valuable than a few clever screen shots from Google Streets. Case in point - recently someone from LBH sent me a photo of our premises he obtained through Google Streets. The shot depicted our furniture and the adjoining premises. It was taken 12 years ago when we first opened and yet he was daft enough to use for accuracy. The furniture is long since gone as is the adjoining premises - Pizza Makers. I know this because we are now in possession of it and I sit here typing this.

David Lesniak ● 2188d

David, that's just not correct. I looked at the effect on Green Lanes precisely because it was relevant to Chiswick. In addition Councillor Biddolph claimed that there was reliable data showing the effect on sales of the introduction of the bike lanes. In fact it was impossible to draw any conclusions from the very scrappy numbers they provided.It was also claimed that dozens of shops had closed down due to the bike lanes. In fact the number of vacancies had dropped after the bike lanes were built, and there up-to-date Streetview shots were very useful in being able to confirm this in short order.  Despite that clear evidence, one Enfield councillor was insistent he had the list to confirm the numbers of closures, but that list never materialised.It would therefore be very useful if Councillor Biddolph were able to share the "factual, comparative and compelling" data she has that shows sales taking an "immediate nosedive" in May when parking was first removed from TGT. The conversations I've had with retailers there show a much more mixed picture with one saying parking has never been an issue as there's plenty of space round the corner on South Parade. It's the low usage of the tube that's the main problem at the moment, and that's not likely to improve any time soon. 

Tom Pike ● 2188d

A minor point in this data duel. As far as I can recall virtually all of those parking spaces "round the corner" on South Parade are all for residents only. This may have changed but that certainly used to be the case.

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

Correct is the fact you refuse to acknowledge the traders' facts and experience as they know them.Interesting thing about Streetview. It doesn't list which shops are listed for rent or for sale. Dig deeper. You're an engineer. And yet you kinda forget to carry the one and do the total sum but you still present the "result" as fact.

David Lesniak ● 2188d

It’s certainly no longer resident only, and always has space.

Tom Pike ● 2188d

Didn't Ealing Council introduce new parking measures last year whereby they were encouraging people to park and allowing them to pay for parking all day, where as before it was residents only? The rules seem to change frequently whereby initially the CPZ's were introduced to discourage non residents not to use the streets for commuting, to then encouraging people to park all day by offering the option of commuter parking at a price. If councils were discouraging car use, then I never understood the new practice they put in place last year to encourage them back again...?? I may be wrong, but I am sure I read that last year and can only assume the council needed a larger income from parking fees.

J Morse ● 2188d

Tom, you are just not listening to what folk are telling you on here. Let us take this weekend as an example, traffic was tailing back when i walked down to get my newspaper on Saturday morning and the same on Saturday evening.yesterday afternoon had to go to B&Q which should normally be a 5-10 minute drive which took 20 mins and that was on my motor bike! On my return journey, the traffic was gridlocked from B&Q and drivers were dangerously doing U turns or too busy on their phones looking at traffic apps. Even bus drivers were frustrated, at least 10 buses stuck in the jam, a total disaster. You can show us all the charts and slightly dodgy photos of how the new HR road lay out is working but I and many on here are telling you otherwise. Are you suggesting that we are making it up?

James Smith-Jones ● 2188d

Good and balanced read on LTN's below in case you have not seen it. https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/nov/01/car-free-neighbourhoods-the-unlikely-new-frontline-in-the-culture-wars

Matthew Swain ● 2188d

I think you're right. There's a whole raft of stuff about it on the Bedford Park Society website. I do remember the kerfuffle over the all day commuter parking business though I wasn't personally affected. We have a friend who lives on South Parade, and I know there certainly was a time when the whole stretch of South Parade was residents only as it was always a pain if we drove there.  I just looked at Hounslow's website under the "find somewhere to park" section and amusingly it still says there is 30 minutes free parking available on Turnham Green Terrace and Devonshire Road. They probably thought it wasn't worth changing the page as of course the current restrictions are only temporary!

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

😄 JV...Give me a break Did the Guardian get the opposite view

Julian Pavey ● 2188d

That Guardian piece is an excellent bit of reporting. No doubt the article will get selectively quoted so I might as well get in now.  According to the delightfully-named Rosamund Kissi Debrah, a woman with more reason than most to support LTNs: “If you randomly rang me up and said, ‘Rosamund, what do you think about a low-traffic neighbourhood?’, I’d say, ‘Ooh, that sounds great definitely.’ But where I live, and I can only talk about Lewisham, it has been a disaster.”  (What was that discussion about the value of generalised opinion polls?) I also thought Tom might like to chew on this statistic offered up by On London's Dave Hill:
"Hill also thinks that the typical demographic of the London cyclist has become a factor. According to TfL’s Cycling Trends Update of July 2019, only 27% of cycle trips are made by women and more than 85% of the city’s cyclists are white. A high proportion – often more than 20% or 30% – are from households with a yearly income of over £75,000. Some of those opposed to LTNs clearly feel that the schemes encourage gentrification by stealth. “For some people in some of those areas,” says Hill, “the whole cycling, clean air, low-traffic neighbourhood agenda is another example of their neighbourhood changing in ways they don’t like and don’t have any control over.”

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

Julian did you take the time to read it?

Matthew Swain ● 2188d

Glad you took the time to read it Bruce,  I also thought it was a good article. The cycling trend stats are interesting.  I wonder how the 2019 numbers would compare, like for like in 2020 where we know there has been an increase in cycling.  I hope that the demographics would have improved,  it certainly looks that's way from what I see on my rides but that is obviously a non-scientific observation.

Matthew Swain ● 2188d

Agreed a reasonably balanced article, although presumably the football team coach might find it harder to cycle with bibs, balls etc.A couple of things stand out to me. Firstly, to be clear, there are no new LTNs north of the High Rd. Closing TGT or DR does not make an LTN. There are broader LTNs south of the A4, though many feel elements of these schemes are problematic. It still seems bizarre to plan to invite hundreds of sports fan to park in one of the most controlled segments of said LTN.The point about fairness to me is 100% central. THe person quoted saying it cannot be fair to have completely no cars on one street and then funnel more traffic onto already congested roads nearby. This is completely right and is the flaw on the pointless closure of TGT, which is still not an LTN. Hounslow and the lobbyists ignore completely the issue of congestion and pollution on already busy roads. Please, please dont post of traffic evaporation, it does not happen.Finally, going back to some of the more 'successful' schemes, such as the oft quoted Waltham FOrest. These schemes were designed 100% to address the needs of the local area, with extensive consultation with residents and businesses before and during the trial phases. Note only residents, carefully controlled to remove external influences. And business was consulted every step of the way.The contrast with Chiswick could not be greater. Whatever its long term impact, noone said ooh look, Chiswick needs a cycle superhighway through its centre, that will really address lots of local transport issues. Not a single person. TFL drew up the plans to have a number of arterial cycle routes and the High Road fitted the bill. That is basically where we are now, but with a temporary version that is far worse than the full version.

Paul Green ● 2188d

Councillor Biddolph says she has the data from the retailers showing the nosedive in sales with the removal of parking, and I'm very happy for analysis to be based on that as and when she is happy to share it. I'm not sure why she is delaying releasing it, though.As I said, there are mixed messages from retailers I've talked to - I'm not refusing to acknowledge what they've said, quite the opposite. Some comparative data, if available, would be very useful.

Tom Pike ● 2188d

Tom, given your reliance last week on a photo which at best could be described as being economical with the truth I for one can’t bring myself to believe a word you now say.

Mark Talbot ● 2188d

A friend in Ealing has just posted on Facebook that a group called OneEaling (Residents against LTNs) are using something called Crowdfunder.co.uk to fund a legal case against Ealing Council to get LTNs removed and bring in local consultation. So far, they've got over £18600, their target being £30000. The main difference between this and LBH is that Ealing Council is located close to where the people of Ealing live, whereas for LBH, Chiswick is a far-away country of which they know nothing.

Colin Jordan ● 2188d

Mark, that photo has suggested a few people are willing to believe the worst of somebody they disagree with despite any evidence.

Tom Pike ● 2188d

It should also be noted, Bruce, Rosamund Kissi-Debrah is the mother of a young girl who died from severe asthma at the age of nine. The precise example of why these measures are being shoved in so quickly.She goes on to say "for people who live in an LTN, yes, life is better, I don't deny that. But their traffic is going somewhere. And this brings up all sorts of issues: social justice, and environmental justice. You cannot live in a neighbourhood where one part has an LTN and and children are cycling and playing outside and the roads are safe, the pop along a couple of roads later and there's gridlocked traffic. We cannot live in a society like that."Something many of us have pointed out despite being harassed with the threat of being boycotted, despite being portrayed as "anti LTN." I guess now Paulo et al will aim that vitriol toward Ms. Kissi-Debrah. That'll be a fine look on him.Thanks to Matthew for providing this evidence.

David Lesniak ● 2188d

There's a national crisis affecting High Streets, and to depict it as a local problem with local causes is simplistic, to say the least. The article stand-first (below) from the Guardian is 18 months old. It predates the pandemic, predates LTNs, and is from somewhen when the economy was still relatively buoyant...'The number of shops lying empty soared by more than 7,500 last year, according to new data that lays bare the crisis on the high street.''The number of new shops, restaurants, pubs and other retail openings slipped by 4.4% to 43,278. Closures increased slightly to 50,828 resulting in a 37% rise in net closures compared with 2018, the biggest in at least five years, according to the Local Data Company.'

Ken Munn ● 2188d

'She goes on to say "for people who live in an LTN, yes, life is better, I don't deny that. But their traffic is going somewhere.'That is not evidence,  that is a theory, a theory which would be worthwhile looking at but a theory none the less.

Matthew Swain ● 2188d

I realised that David — that's why I said that Ms Kiss-Debrah has more reason than most to support LTNs. It didn't save her from being attacked for her views by those who really should have counted to ten before taking to Twitter. On the subject of Twitter, I thought Paul Campbell's tantrum over the posters was childish in the extreme and I hope that on reflection he regrets what he did. To my mind the tirade had distictly worrying historical precedents out of all proportion with an admittedly passionate debate about traffic schemes.

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

I’m sorry to disappoint you Bruce but I still feel the same about shops displaying the poster and I am as free to express my personal opinions on that as I am to choose where I spend my money and why. I exercised the same freedom of choice when the Redesign CS9 posters were displayed and I have continued to do so ever since. There are passionately held views on both sides of this debate.

Paul Campbell ● 2188d

Paul, of course you are free to spend your money where you will and I have no problem with that. However, while I may be wrong, I rather doubt that you actually frequent all the establishments you chose to "shame" for displaying the poster. Hence the clear implication was that you were encouraging everyone who shares your views in  this awful divisive business to boycott the businesses themselves, which is something entirely different. Personally I can't see the difference between a shop displaying this poster or one that says "stop the third runway" or "save Charing Cross". Would you also encourage a boycott of anywhere that expressed such a view if it wasn't yours? 

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

Part of Chiswick is in LBE including Southfield and Fisher's Lane

Claire Moran ● 2188d

You are free to ascribe whatever motives you choose and you may have noticed that I do not object to the personal criticism from you and others. If those campaigns used ugly and aggressive language and methods, encouraged people to use abusive language on their forums and actively worked to create an out-group of people who ride bikes, propagating conspiracy theories to demonise them and making them more vulnerable than they already are when going about their daily business then the answer is, yes, I would choose not to spend my money in shops that displayed their posters. And I would very likely express my views as well. I would also scrutinise their political affiliations and ask who provides their funding and why.

Paul Campbell ● 2188d

"Ugly and aggressive language and methods". Now who would employ dirty tricks like that?Have you considered meeting fire with fire Paul? Why not print up some posters of your own and ask Chiswick shopkeepers to display them in their windows? I promise  not to boycott any that support your cause.  Hearts and minds old chap, hearts and minds.

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

Ken, all the more reason why we as a community should be fighting to protect our high street. We are in a pandemic and now more than ever local councils should be supporting their communities and NOT making detrimental changes to shopping streets which is Turnham Green Terrace and parking. Let alone closing a shopping street utter madness, Hounslow are unfit to serve. Ealing should also consult on fishers lane, those of us who live north of the high road are stuck between 2 councils that clearly do not communicate.

Jayne Thorburn ● 2188d

Precisely. I am not a campaign group, I am not a spokesperson for a campaign group, I am not a member of a campaign group. I am not affiliated to any political party, I am not affiliated to a sketchy organisation that does not declare who funds it or who is associated with far-right activists from Welling and I am not asking businesses or anybody else to display posters advertising my cause. I have not set up a Facebook forum where people gather to abuse their neighbours and to organise pile-ons on their opponents’ social media accounts. I am a private resident with my own views on what I see as the necessity of rethinking urban design to create a better environment for my children and society . And I am as free to express those views as I am to exercise choice in where I spend my money. I think you’re starting to understand my position on this better.

Paul Campbell ● 2188d

You and me both then.

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

“ugly and aggressive language and methods” Might you be wise putting your own house in order there Paul?https://mobile.twitter.com/paulocampbell/status/1321585641369591808

Russell Pearson ● 2188d

I am beginning to get worried about Paul. His posts are getting more and more unfathomable and when I looked at that tweet  (I don't do Twitter myself, nor Facebook) I had to specifically allow viewing of replies "including those that may contain offensive content". The only offensive bit was a tweet from Paul in an extra large font snarling about angry geriatrics which rightly earned him a telling-off. 

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

You believe what you read in the Telegraph?. So Ken please do let us know what paper, in your view, does a better job at telling the truth.

David Lovegrove ● 2188d

It’s very bizarre. I can understand people having passionate opinions. The hatred against older people, the campaign against shops that are trying to defend their livelihood, and the vitriol against anyone with an alternative view, is pretty disturbing.

Russell Pearson ● 2188d

Well I suppose the shops will have more to worry about now than a one-man boycott. I wonder how many if them will be left to care about parking, cycle lanes, footfall and suchlike when this is all over.

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

That is my description of the antagonist at The Italians incident which I am free to express as a private resident who does not represent any organisation. The lady who was told to “eff off” by the owner because of how “remarkably rude” she was, according to the report of a witness who opposes the road changes, spends a great deal of time on social media describing herself as an elderly person with multiple health concerns who hates people who ride bikes. It is an accurate description and you are as free to be offended as I am to express my view.

Paul Campbell ● 2188d

So are you saying that:“And watch out for the angry geriatric bike-haters”Was a comment you support?

Russell Pearson ● 2188d

Well it is my comment that I have explained so what do you think? Would you like me to start posting screenshots from OneChiswick on here and asking the contributors, including you, if they support their comments too? I think the forum watchers would find it quite interesting to see what happens when like-minded people feel free to express their views in a “private” group don’t you?

Paul Campbell ● 2188d

My advice is to stop lurking in ‘invite only’ Facebook groups, as it’s clearly not doing you any good. If you want to underline your reputation as a dog’s lost biscuit, then please go ahead and post.I do think you owe an apology though, for your very rude and nasty comment about elderly people.

Russell Pearson ● 2188d

You need space on the pavement to queue at a distance when only a couple of customers can be in a shop at the same time.You need space for trolleys on the pavement and also for mobility scooters.Cycles don't have to have only two wheels. They can have more... and they can also be electric.Here's someone who is no spring chicken on his tricycle.https://twitter.com/gylesb1/status/1270767304071155713?lang=en https://www.gylesbrandreth.net/blog/2020/7/4/th8q3iv2tpyo8wj0xivej555d8i94x

Philippa Bond ● 2188d

And available from only £799.99 to £3099.99. I guess Mr Brandreth must fall into that over £75k pa category!

Bruce Hammal ● 2188d

"I am a private resident with my own views on what I see as the necessity of rethinking urban design to create a better environment"We agree, Paul. I am a private resident and I am a local business owner. With both those hats on I see a necessity for rethinking urban design. As a trained and practiced architect I am familiar with urban design strategies and techniques not to mention the discipline. It is something I have studied my entire adult life.Sadly none of that is evident. You know as well as I do that does not make me "anti" rather it makes me aware of what is missing. Critical thinking is another form of analysis. And given we are talking about public works, democracy and engagement will also play a part. Admittedly design by committee is never easy. Burying your head in the sand ignoring those shortcomings does nothing to further your cause. It only exacerbates the situation and prolongs resolution.But you are opting to promote a boycott of those businesses who are speaking up. They are not speaking against. They are speaking up. And you believe silencing them is the way to go. You choose to publicize boycotting traders who are about to shut down for the second time in four months. Some of whom have seen a reduction in trade by 85% year on year. You are advocating delivery services that come with a surcharge for those precise traders while the likes of Amazon, Ocado, etc. pay no such surcharge let alone taxes commensurate with their trade. You are choosing to advocate for shutting off access to businesses that have served this community in some cases for longer than you've been alive. For us as with many businesses, we will again shift to more deliveries. In March we could deliver without penalty and in a timely fashion. Now it remains unclear where we can go and when. We run the risk of getting a PCN. And we will have to spend precious more time sitting in traffic because we are being forced to go around the block to get to the corner. There is nothing efficient about it. And at a time when businesses have reduced staff, reduced trade and increased overhead (like it or not, time is money and that translates into overhead) that is a recipe for disaster. Businesses should not be asked to spend more time doing less but that is what you demand. There couldn't be anything more anti about your stance as it poses a direct threat to the very environment you seek to redesign. And it oddly amuses me that you can't see that because you are too busy seething and attempting to generate hate for any of us who can. One key difference between us: in my version businesses get the support and infrastructure (however modified) they need to ensure there will be a high street when this pandemic is finally under control. Who knows how many more lockdowns we all may endure.You prefer to punish businesses in the current climate and you somehow believe that will leave the high street in a better more secure place. The elephant in the room is Brexit whose impact we can expect to see in a matter of weeks as payment processing protocols change among other things. Traders stand to see an increase in processing fees and the possibility of not being able to accept anything other than UK debit cards. But in your line of work you wouldn't know that just as in your line of work you don't know what it takes to sustain a high road retail or hospitality business. I know you think you do. But you don't.And you also seem to think it a good idea to jeopardize the enormous amount of resources being poured in to support the economy overall. A debt we will all have to repay eventually. Only thing is with less businesses able to pitch in as a result of your scenario, the more individuals like you will need to contribute. The debt will fall more squarely on your shoulders.

David Lesniak ● 2187d

Paul, could you do us all a solid and please square your circle between your poor-Paul-is-a-victim post above to the your bit about "propogating conspiracy theories to demonise them" to your tweet "and watch our for the angry geriatric bike-haters?"You have just demonised a group of people while at the same time wiping your tears for having been "demonised."

David Lesniak ● 2187d

It is interesting the mentality of those that are so dedicated to their cause that they cannot see any other perspective, take any dissent or criticism as heresy, and mix victimhood and aggression. It is like a cult. The individual named here is the lead protagonist and frankly seems rather unpleasant.

Paul Green ● 2187d

Paul seems to be citing freedom of expression in defence of his personal shop-boycott campaign while berating the shop-keepers for choosing to avail themselves of the same liberty in the defence of their livelihoods.

Bruce Hammal ● 2187d

Do you only buy things new?

Philippa Bond ● 2187d

At the moment I don't buy anything!

Bruce Hammal ● 2187d

And available from only £799.99 to £3099.99.Looks cheap compared to a car, I don't see many £3k cars in Chiswick,  in fact I don't see many under £30K at times?

Matthew Swain ● 2187d