Forum Topic

Time to Postpone Trade Talks with the EU?

It perplexes me that more people are not raising the obvious question of why we are intending to persist with reshaping our relationship with the EU, a path which will involve a huge amount of dislocation for our economy when the coronavirus is already causing this to happen. This doesn't mean rejoining the EU but postponing the trade talks and remaining aligned with the single market until we are clear of the current crisis. The massive demands that the talks will place on an already overstretched civil service are bound to create a range of difficulties.Our PM is not known for his work ethic but even a more conscientous leader would struggle to cope with the workload that will be placed on them.If we leave the EU during a pandemic we reduce the ability of our universities to work with other institutions in Europe to develop a cure.It has already been reported that outside EU institutions we will not have the same access to EU developed vaccines that hopefully will become available.We have over the past few days had ample demonstration how even minor disruptions to supply chains can lead to hoarding and shortages. If the pandemic is still an issue and any new trading arrangement interrupt the free low of goods, there will be far worse scenes in our local shops and many people will have to go without basic essentials.The notion that freedom of movement presents an extra risk during a pandemic has been thoroughly disproven with EU countries closing their borders to each other for health reasons.If you don't agree that trade talks should be put on hold could you explain to me what are the benefits which outweigh all the negatives detailed above?

Mark Evans ● 2425d21 Comments

Well, it would make sense. But it’s not going to happen as long as Johnson is in charge and taking instructions from Cummings, Westley et al.

Stewart Jones ● 2425d

Unless some of the delegates go down with Covoid-19 there seems no reason to delay the talks. If the pandemic continues there might be a case for delaying the implementation of the agreement.

Richard Greenhough ● 2425d

Think you are completely misunderstanding the point Richard. The talks themselves are not the risk but the realignment of policy that will result. Even if you believe the ultimate results will be positive, the transition will be highly disruptive and absorb a lot of resources both public and private sector.I'm not sure what you mean by not delaying the talks but delaying implementation of the agreement but if you are suggesting signing a trade deal but holding off on applying it, that would be totally impractical.To not delay the talks you have to believe the current  government is capable of handling two of the largest organisational challenges that have been presented to any post-war administration at the same time. Does their performance so far, for instance with their response to the floods, give any indication that they could do this?

Francis Rowe ● 2424d

RG > "If the pandemic continues there might be a case for delaying the implementation of the agreement."That would be illegal.

John Whitworth ● 2424d

The BBC is reporting that Michel Barnier has tested positive for Covid-19, so I guess that means the talks will be postponed.

Richard Greenhough ● 2422d

Wishing a Barnier a full and speedy recovery.

Matthew Swain ● 2422d

RG > "If the pandemic continues there might be a case for delaying the implementation of the agreement."That would be illegal.Easily fixed.... if there's a will...

John Hickman ● 2421d

JH > "Easily fixed..."Yeah. It's just a shame that someone had the clever idea of 'breaking it' in the first place.

John Whitworth ● 2421d

From a press conference yesterday (? Anyone know?)....I put this on another thread but it seems this one is more appropriateI notice that in a press conference Boris managed to look serious and earnest up to the point when a journalist asked him if, considering the circumstances, he was considering extending the EU departure date of 31st December. The EU is apparently amenable to this. After all, the negotiations are deadly serious for both sides.His rather terse response (whilst barely repressing a snigger) was“It’s not a subject that’s being regularly discussed, I can tell you, in Downing Street at the moment."“And we’re getting on with it. There’s legislation in place that I have no intention of changing.”Irrespective of whether you are for or against Brexit, that is one of the more irresponsible replies I have heard to a serious question in years. Don't forget, it is your future this clown is "negotiating". It is not a class debate where the idea is to score some cheap points at the opposition's expense.The discussions with the EU are to ensure that both of us end up with as good a deal as possible (or should be). Given that the coronavirus has affected negotiators on both sides, deferral of the end date would seem to be a very sensible option.Also hope Barnier recovers quickly

John Hickman ● 2421d

Agree John, anyone can see that with this current crisis taking so much time that trying to keep up with the Brexit talks simultaneously is just stupid. It needs to be put to one side and the transition period extended until we are all out of the woods and the position across the world is clearer. Never have we needed co-operation with our European neighbours more. We truly are all in this together but I don't think 'sensible options' are on Johnson's radar, he's too busy playing the big'I Am'. I haven't heard Gordon Brown's thoughts on this myself, but they have drawn a lot of praise across the board from many commentators.

Vanessa Smith ● 2421d

Yes Brown was excellent on Today this morning. Pointing out succinctly and clearly that the UK is not providing measures to support workers in the same way as other European countries and explaining the economic benefits of doing so. Rishi Sunak came up with an answer for 2008 - credit lines to increase liquidity for businesses. What we need is a fiscal stimulus package for 2020.

Paul Campbell ● 2421d

This obsession with Brexit at all costs has contributed to the government taking their eye off the NHS and even the usual preparations for the winter flu season. Consequently they've been more unprepared than they would be normally. Now this neglect has come back and bitten them on the backside. But it's the brilliant staff who will bear the brunt and soldier on.

Vanessa Smith ● 2421d

Fiscal stimulus package, what do you suggest, Paul?

Jeffrey Cope ● 2421d

Same as Gordon Brown. Same as Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Germany, France etc. Direct underwriting of employment in leisure, hospitality and retail sectors from the government combined with support for businesses that agree to rules that incentivise retention of employees. Direct no-return injection of a 9 figure sum into the economy through employment guarantees. Anathema no doubt to you and our populist government to be forced to adopt classically socialist economic policy in a time of unprecedented crisis even for a short period of time. Too hamstrung by their ideology to do the right things.

Paul Campbell ● 2421d

Same as Gordon Brown. Same as Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Germany, France etc. Direct underwriting of employment in leisure, hospitality and retail sectors from the government combined with support for businesses that agree to rules that incentivise retention of employees. Direct no-return injection of a 9 figure sum into the economy through employment guarantees. Anathema no doubt to you and our populist government to be forced to adopt classically socialist economic policy in a time of unprecedented crisis even for a short period of time. Too hamstrung by their ideology to do the right things.

Paul Campbell ● 2421d

Sorry you have no right to assume I am against "classically socialist economic policy"Again I ask the question and perhaps you would be good enough to provide some estimate of costing to avoid obfuscation?

Jeffrey Cope ● 2421d

Am I wrong about your political leanings? Why don’t you do some work for a change instead of ordering me about and give me your estimate of the costing? I’ll give you one tip - it’s actually 12 figures not 9 and it is points not basis points of national GDP that is required. 9 was a silly error on my part.

Paul Campbell ● 2421d

Sorry Paul, I have no intention of trying to "order you about"I really am asking you to explain your assertions

Jeffrey Cope ● 2421d

Why don’t you explain your objections? Why don’t you tell me about your solutions to the economic crisis that follows the medical crisis? 12 figures  is between £100bn and £999bn do why don’t you explain to me why Mr Jeffrey Cope needs a precise ledger to understand the gist of the argument? Or can you only ask questions of people who challenge your paradigm?

Paul Campbell ● 2421d

Oh and I will take your avoidance of answering simple questions like “am I wrong about your political leanings” to be confirmation that I am not.

Paul Campbell ● 2421d

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-51969708Are they assertions when the Chancellor finally works out that “whatever it takes” must include protecting jobs? Better late than never.

Paul Campbell ● 2421d